Tank steering

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Tank steering

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14 January 2021 at 10:02 #93227
Joe Beckett
Participant
@joebeckett71895
Hi All,

Notposted for a while, been busy building. I am building a twin screw Fairey Huntsman. Everything installed and working. I have;

Flysky FSi6 Tx

Flysky FSiA6 Rx

2x Surpass Hobby d4250 800kv outrunners

2x Flycolor 90A escs (one red wire disconnected and both programmed for forward/reverse)

2x Turnigy 5.0 3 cell Li-pos

I have the radio set up for twin motor, i.e. 2x centre sprung sticks (one for each motor!) and steering on r/h stick. Set to Mode 2.

NOW TO THE HELP REQUIRED!

How do i set up the radio for tank steering? Please could someone give me a real simple button by button guide to set up the radio? At the moment, the escs are not recognising the centre point and power up forwards from the sticks down position with no reverse?

I have found lots on the internet about robots and actual tanks but very little on boats.

To make things easier, I'm not interested in other setups or adding anything else electronic.

Thanks!
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14 January 2021 at 10:02 #2977
Joe Beckett
Participant
@joebeckett71895
Help required
14 January 2021 at 10:26 #93228
Colin Bishop
Moderator
@colinbishop34627
Sounds like the radio is set up OK, it is the ESCs that need programming. Lots of info online but much easier if you have a programming card.

As an aside, tank steering on a performance boat could be tricky.

Colin
14 January 2021 at 10:36 #93229
Joe Beckett
Participant
@joebeckett71895
Hi Colin, Thanks for the reply. I should have mentioned that I have a Flycolor program card and have used that for setting up the escs.

I guess the real question is how to I get the radio (or escs) to recognise the 'neutral' position of the throttle sticks (Fwd/N/Rev – as on the real thing)

Thanks

Joe
14 January 2021 at 10:56 #93230
Colin Bishop
Moderator
@colinbishop34627
Joe,

I can't help with the programming of the ESCs although somebody else might .(I use a different ESC). However I think you can check whether the TX is working OK by connecting each ESC channel to a spare servo or even the rudder to see if it responds normally with the servo centre position matching the stick centre position. If that is OK then the problem would seem to be with the ESC programming. There seem to be some videos online although I've not looked at them.

Colin
14 January 2021 at 11:25 #93231
Joe Beckett
Participant
@joebeckett71895
Hi Colin, Simple thinking, I like it! It worked too. Both sticks are operating correctly when attached to the rudder servo, both return to the 'neutral' posn. That would point to escs but the programming on those with the card is really simple but I guess I'll have to investigate further down that route. Thanks for the help, really appreciate it.

Joe
14 January 2021 at 11:57 #93232
Chris Fellows
Participant
@chrisfellows72943
Hi Joe

With those motors it sounds like a 46.5" Huntsman!

Why do you think it needs tank steering? It is normally used on slower, displacement type boats and ships. As Colin says it will be tricky with a performance boat especially with twin sticks and almost impossible to apply the right amount of throttle to each motor at higher speeds especially when applying rudder as well!

I think the more usual arrangement is to have one stick and the rudder position determines the power split to each motor by use of a mixing board.

If it was me I'd try it on the water first without tank steering.

Chris

Edited By Chris Fellows on 14/01/2021 12:00:10
14 January 2021 at 12:10 #93234
Joe Beckett
Participant
@joebeckett71895
Hi Chris,

I guess you didn't see the bit about other setups or adding anything but thanks for the response anyway! This boat won't be a performance boat running at higher speeds as my club lake is quite small and I am more interested in scale and accuracy. Having owned a real twin motor boat, I was interested to see if I can replicate the real thing.

I think I have solved the issue by reading the esc instructions properly! It says to set the throttle position before you first try to program the escs. I'm just recharging my batteries (literally!) and I'll give that a go.

Thanks again.

Joe
14 January 2021 at 19:27 #93253
Dave Cooper 6
Participant
@davecooper6
Posted by Joe Beckett on 14/01/2021 12:10:21:

This boat won't be a performance boat running at higher speeds as my club lake is quite small and I am more interested in scale and accuracy. Having owned a real twin motor boat, I was interested to see if I can replicate the real thing.

Hi Joe

I'm just wondering if you could get 'differential' throttle by using both sticks with a ratchet – in the 'fore-and-aft' plane so to speak.

The Rx would then have a dedicated channel to each ESC and could be programmed as desired.

I don't know if FlySky is similar to FrSky but, if so, "Open Tx" can be used for additional programming if required. Maybe to fine tune straight running perhaps ?

Good luck with your project,

Dave C
14 January 2021 at 19:58 #93255
Joe Beckett
Participant
@joebeckett71895
Hi Dave,. Thanks for the response. I will investigate differential throttle but, alas, I tried the setting of the throttle position mentioned earlier and the escs are still not recognising the throttle position, so with or without ratchet, there is no reverse as both throttles start at zero and go to max full ahead at the top. I have each ESC on a different channel and both do the same thing. I appear to be doing everything that the ESC manual says but ending with a different response. The beeps I get do not correspond to the info in the manual. Even both motors on one channel won't solve the throttle position issue. Not sure what to try next? Perhaps try contacting the Chinese manufacturer. Thanks. Joe
14 January 2021 at 21:15 #93256
Dave Cooper 6
Participant
@davecooper6
Those pesky bleeps Joe ! Check that they're on the right version of the firmware and /or you have the matching documentation…

.
14 January 2021 at 23:16 #93257
Charles Oates
Participant
@charlesoates31738
Hi Joe, to boil this down to the basics, and ignoring the tank control, I think you're saying that the esc,s won't set up for normal centre off, up for forward and back for reverse.

I'm assuming that you're following the basics, stick and trim in the centre before switching the tx on, and then powering up the receiver and esc.

Occasionally I've seen escs that don't recognize 'standard' stick centre, it's worth trying the above with the trims a little each way before switching on the equipment.

I notice that the instructions are on the web, do these manuals corespond with the one you're using for the set up?

There's a youtube video about setting up flycolour escs in a boat, have you seen it and did it help?

I don't know if any of that will help you, good luck with them.

Charles.
15 January 2021 at 09:10 #93259
Joe Beckett
Participant
@joebeckett71895
Morning All, Thanks for the advice Charles. Here's a bizarre thing. Left it alone for a few hours 'cos I was frustrated, tried randomly switching everything on later in the evening and it all worked as it should, very odd! It's till working fine this morning and now after having tried tank steering (even on the desk) and consuming a fair portion of humble pie, have changed over to 1 stick for both motors with mixing and proportional control (thanks Colin & Chris!). Now going to fit rudders and cooling pipework and drop it in the bath for her maiden voyage!!!

Thanks again for all the advice.
15 January 2021 at 09:34 #93260
Colin Bishop
Moderator
@colinbishop34627
Joe,

When you are operating a full size twin screw boat you are probably operating the two throttle levers with one hand and the rudder with the other so it is relatively easy to adjust the engines independently.

With a model boat setup you are using one hand each for the morors and one of those hands has to double for the rudder as well.

A Robbe Navy Twin Stick TX does have both motor controls on the left hand of the set so you can replicate the full size setup.

**LINK**

Colin
15 January 2021 at 11:33 #93262
Tim Cooper
Participant
@timcooper90034
Joe

I have a Robbe TX with the Navy twin stick. For most of the time on the water they are locked together so both motors are driven together. Very useful for steering at slower speed or manoeuvring.

Tim
15 January 2021 at 11:51 #93263
Chris Fellows
Participant
@chrisfellows72943
Glad you're sorted Joe.

The other thing with models is that you are almost continually adjusting speed and direction, especially on a small lake (our club one is as well) whereas with a full-size boat you tend to maintain speed and direction for longer periods and tank steering with smaller boats would only be used for docking/mooring.

Chris
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