From 12 photos and 1 drawing to a set of plans?

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19 January 2009 at 22:53 #18023
Michael Staats
Participant
@michaelstaats57862
Hello folks,

I am reseaching the sailing vessel, the ‘Peter Iredale’ she was built on the orders of Peter Iredale himself by R. Ritson & Co of Marport, Cumbria. She was a steel hulled four masted barque that was launched in June of 1890 and ran aground on the Clatsop Spit while making making for the Columbia River Bar in the Pacific Northwest on October 25, 1906.

Original builder’s drawings, made on tracing paper, that were submitted to Lloyd’s for vessel classification are housed in the National Maritime Museum in Greenwich, be are to fraglile to be scanned.

I have literally spent hundreds of hours conducting internet research and sending emails to individuals, museums, and historical societies. My net results are 12 photographs taken within 3 weeks of her grounding and a one page semi-scaled drawing showing the sheer plan, body plan and half-breath plan…all with the Load Water Level (LWL).

The problem with the drawing is that it is based on photographs of the ship shortly after she went aground…probably the same photographs that I have.

The deck fittings (90% +/-) I can can get or deduce from the photgraphs (hopefully). The mast diameters can be gotten from the wreck site…if and when the shifting sands uncover her enough to do so. I have a “period” manual on the sizing of masts, yards, and sail areas…so I can probably reverse engineer their approximate sizes based on the aforementioned mast diameters.

So the continueance of the project rests soley on whether or not I can generate an accurate hull plan. In your opinions, do I have enough information to generate a set of plans for the ship’s hull?

If I do have enough information, do I hire a naval architect or do I get a 3D CAD program to generate the frame/bulkhead drawings?

Since I don’t want to spend more money doing research and drawing generation than actually building the model, I would prefer a “freeware” or “shareware” CAD program…but that is not locked in if I can find an affordable draftsman. Any recommendations on which CAD programs (freeware/shareware/purchased) that I should investigate?

Any thoughts, opinions, encouragements, or insights will be greatly appreciated. Thank you

Mike Staats

West Linn, Oregon

USA
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19 January 2009 at 22:53 #6535
Michael Staats
Participant
@michaelstaats57862
Can I scratch build without a set of plans?
20 January 2009 at 06:51 #18031
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Hi Mike

The answer to your question depends upon how much you know about ship construction and how proficient you are at using CAD software.

The information that you have should be enough to produce a reasonable set of construction drawings from which templates could be developed provided that you are able to “fill in the gaps” where the source information is missing.

In my opinion there is no such thing as a free CAD programme as all free or shareware is very limited in scope.

I use a few different CAD programmes depending upon what I wish to produce but in this case I would recommend that you try TurboCad which is a very good and relatively simple to operate system that includes a superb 3D facility, try looking for version 8 which is now fairly cheap to buy.

If you would like more in depth advice then please upload what information you have and I will take a look.

I hope that this has been of some help.

Paul (North West England)
20 January 2009 at 13:12 #18040
Len Ochiltree
Participant
@lenochiltree67043
Hi Mike,

If you are going to make a model then just go for it using what you have.

There are plenty of ” Rivet Counters ” about but don’t let them put you off.

If you do build then please let us see photos of the Build.

Good luck.

Len.

Hi Paul,

For the moment I thought my vision had improved somewhat, was your message a copy and paste job ?.

Len, enjoying a week off.
20 January 2009 at 13:20 #18041
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Hi Len

Yes I was playing with copy and paste from the office programme to see if the font changed………………as you can see it didn’t.

Having a week off have you just woke up or is it a break from decorating?

Paul
20 January 2009 at 13:37 #18043
Len Ochiltree
Participant
@lenochiltree67043
Hi Paul,

Just using up my yearly quota of annual leave,(41 days including Bank Holidays ).

Len.
22 January 2009 at 14:06 #18075
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Hi Len

41 days holiday is great….in the holiday ratings you must rank third after teachers and santa……mind you the teachers are a long way in front of you and run a close second to santa who only works one day a year.

Paul
22 January 2009 at 14:08 #18076
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Hello Mike

As the person who started this thread have you found the information of any use?

Paul
22 January 2009 at 23:02 #18093
Michael Staats
Participant
@michaelstaats57862
Hello Paul:

Yes the information that I have found has been helpful though to a limited extent.

I have downloaded a “free” 3D CAD program called PowerSHAPE from Delcam, which I believe is based in Birmingham. I have yet to “get into” the program, as I am sure it will have a fairly stiff learning curve, when I’m not sure I have enough information to justify the time required.

I will download several of my pictures and the one drawing when I have learned about this site’s procedures for doing so in order that you might provide me with some additional advice or insight.

I’ve contacted the NMM again regarding 2 other similiarly sized barques built by the Ritson yard that might loosely be called sister ships, the ‘Auchencairn’ and the ‘Willy Rickmers’. It seems I can get mast and spar “blueprints” for the ‘Auchencairn’ and a deck paln and rigging plan for the ‘Willy Rickmers’. I’m now waiting to receive “snail mail” from them regarding ordering information and pricing”.

Mike Staats

West Linn, Oregon

USA
22 January 2009 at 23:25 #18094
Michael Staats
Participant
@michaelstaats57862
Paul:

I have downloaded the drawing and four photographs of the ‘Peter Iredale’ into my ‘Peter Iredale” album.

I have other photographs I can download as well, but they differ from the downloaded photographs, as well as one another, based primarally on the angle at which the photographer took the picture as well as distance from the ship. These are four of the better photographs.

I was supprised that I did not have to resize the photo’s as I have had to do on other modeling web sites…really suprised, since the port aft photo is in excess of 1Mb in size.

Hope this helps.

Mike Staats

West Linn, Oregon

USA
23 January 2009 at 07:26 #18099
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Good Morning Mike

Well its morning over here….and wet & windy….whats the weather like in Oregon?

I will have a good look at the drawing and photos and if they look suitable I shall upload them into my CAD and see if it is worth your while learning to use your freeware.

Paul
23 January 2009 at 07:40 #18101
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Hi Again Mike

The drawing uploaded very well and is perfect for producing a set of working drawings and templates. All of the information is there including a very useful scale that runs the entire length of the hull.

The photos are a great help as they will enable you to fill in the details.

This will be a great project and I look forward to seeing the results……..good luck with the CAD and if you need any help please feel free to ask.

Paul
23 January 2009 at 09:27 #18105
Bob Abell 2
Participant
@bobabell2
Hello Mike

There is a company on this actual page!……..Brown Son and Ferguson………..anfdthey have a vast collection of professional old ships drawings……. their catalogue is full of ships similar to your intended model

I would try them before you start drawing the hull yourself.

Regards…………Bob
24 January 2009 at 07:38 #18120
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Good Morning Mike (& Bob as I see you are on line)

I have downloaded the powershape freeware and whilst it is a very adapt system its primary use is for 3D modelling and is fairly limited in its ability as a drawing programme. I only say this as i don’t want you to spend hours trying to get something out of the software that will be very difficult to do.

Paul
24 January 2009 at 12:00 #18126
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Hi Mike

I have been thinking about your problem and might have some different answers but first what scale are you going to build to and what sort of model will it be?? i.e. static or radio controlled?

Paul
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