Wild Duck meets Eventide

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Wild Duck meets Eventide

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  • #119396
    Tim Rowe
    Participant
      @timrowe83142

      I have taken a it of a break since last posting and that was on the old forum.  I was a bit put off by the shaky start to this new forum shared also with the Model Engineer.  The model flying forum was changed first and I think it is better but hey ho!

      I don’t think anyone can  keep up with Ray Wood and I am not even trying but three of his design caught my eye and are on the stocks.  I am building 2 of his Cary 32 powerboats but this is another story.  This one is about Wild Duck and Eventide.  Like Ray I also build aircraft and plastic kits but as the nearest airfield is miles away and I live in a port it made sense to do more boating.

      Ray kindly sent me a set of plans for Wild Duck and Eventide I got from the magazine free plan.  I am building them side by side so I can share my mistakes between them!

      For those who were kind enough to follow my build of Galileo, I did get it finished and here are a couple of photos.

      IMG_4983

      76fa48a4-429d-4720-8c81-f37c967bd89d

      This is the big rig and the boats sails very well.

       

      Tim Rowe

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      #119430
      Ray Wood 3
      Participant
        @raywood3

        Hello Tim,

        That was an epic restoration, a while ago now she looks great so that usually means good sailing 🙂

        You are a glutton for punishment building the 2 models together, see you in June for some sailing !!

        Best RayShandau 1 200324

        #119446
        Tim Rowe
        Participant
          @timrowe83142

          Lovely picture of Shandau with a very purposeful bow wave.

          Eventide and Wild Duck are proving great fun to build.  These are my first semi-scale boats and while I have been following the plans quite faithfully the first change was to go metric and use what material I had to hand rather than buying stuff.

          DSC01524

          With boats that are going to sail I like to build as light as possible so any weight save can go into the keel.  The frames therefore are Liteply and skinnier than drawn.  Not everybody likes Liteply as the sheet can be quite distorted but this is easy to rectify when everything is jigged up and it is much easier to work than birch ply or marine ply.  Litely ply is fine as long as it is really well sealed.

          I like to try to plan ahead a bit and the flat section on the left hand frame is one of two that will take a platform for the sail winch.  The frame on the right shows the lower sections coming up to the keel rather than “egg-boxing” over the top.  This makes them a bit flimsy to start with but when everything is glued up, the structure is nice and stable.  Doing this makes for a bit more room inside the hull.  As soon as they are cut I give them a single coat of epoxy to seal leaving the glued edges bare so that I can use epoxy or aliphatic glue later on.  Often I use aliphatic glue because it has a fast grab which epoxy doesn’t until the moment it is cured.

          Between the two boats, that was a lot of frames.

          Tim Rowe

           

          #119566
          Tim Rowe
          Participant
            @timrowe83142

            Ray’s plan is drawn imperial and gauge sizes for wire and plate.  Like a foreign language in Spain so everything is converted for metric.

            The keel of both boats are made from 5mm ply.

            DSC01528

            Here is the forward section of Eventide with the bow lightened out a bit.  The small holes are 0.5 mm and mark the positions of the frames.  They are drill right through and this is an easy way to make sure the frames line up on each side. The large holes are 3mm and are for dowels, used later to jig all the bits in the right place.

            DSC01529

            This is the aft section complete with skeg. First mistake was to mis-read the drawing and I had to add back on the vertical piece to support the transom.

            DSC01531

            There are two of these making up the side cheeks to make the slot for the sailing keel.

            Wild Duck’s keel is made up exactly the same way.

            Tim

             

             

             

             

            #119694
            Tim Rowe
            Participant
              @timrowe83142

              Here the keel sections come together and the dowels make sure everything goes in its correct position when everything is finally glued up

              DSC01537

              Like this:

              DSC01538

              Ray’s keel slot was open at the top but I wanted mine closed off, partly so there would be no chance of water coming in but also it makes it easier to locate the retaining pin.  Simply push the keel in until it stops and the pin holes will line up.

              DSC01539

              There is a debate going on about glues.  I share Colin’s favourite which is Aliphatic.  This works like white glue but is water resistant.  In real boatbuilding I have used loads of Cascamite and I love the smell!

               

               

               

               

              #119860
              Tim Rowe
              Participant
                @timrowe83142

                Don’t forget that when the keel is fully assembled you will have a deep slot that will be almost impossible to seal and paint.  As my DIY plywood was of doubtful origin I could take no chances as delamination or swelling would be a disaster.

                DSC01540

                The slot was therefore masked off and the sides, and the fore and aft ends carefully sealed.  I am a great fan of epoxy where an immediate bond is not necessary.  The reason is that it double as a coating and as a glue.  I can seal the surfaces and then glue the surfaces which is very strong and keeps the water out.

                DSC01541

                Here, the closing half is sealed as well nearly ready for finally fixing.

                DSC01543

                The two pieces are now drilled for the fin retaining bolt.  The two sides were drilled at the same time with the dowels keeping everything in the right place. The loose piece was put in while drilling to prevent break-out on the underside of the plywood. Having done its job it is thrown away.

                DSC01544

                I have no idea how often the fin will be put in and taken out but each time there is a risk of wear to the hole and loosing the sealing.  This is exactly what I am trying to avoid so each side had a short section of brass tube epoxied in place for the bolt to pass through.  You can see the burr from the tube cutting tool but this was removed when the brass bush was filed down to be flush with the plywood sides.

                The plan called for an aluminium fin but I didn’t have any and it is hard to source in Mallorca.  I did have some good quality 2mm ply so I glued two pieces back to back to get me to 4mm which is the width of the slot.  It was a bit flexible and probably OK for Eventide which is unlikely to be sailed in heavy weather but I decided to experiment.

                P1000369

                I milled out two semi-circular grooves on both side of the fin to just over 1mm in depth.  The were then completely filled with carbon fibre tows in epoxy.

                P1000373

                I weighted down the tows over a plastic film and then sanded off the excess.  The result was a very stiff fin probably as good as the alloy but lighter.  It was one experiment that worked well and I will use for wild Duck and other builds I have in mind.

                 

                Tim

                #119864
                Richard Simpson
                Participant
                  @richardsimpson88330

                  Absolutely superb job and very interesting to see your thinking during the build.  Never having built a yacht with a removable keel I had never even thought about the challenge of sealing the slot.  By coincidence though I have a yacht built by a very prolific yacht building club member who has since sadly passed away but his yacht has a lot of similarities with yours.

                  29-11-06-13WiltonParkBermudaAnnette4

                  22-07-13-08FittedYachtKeel1

                  #119865
                  Tim Rowe
                  Participant
                    @timrowe83142

                    That’s a truly beautiful yacht Richard and a great answer to your musings about getting compound curves from flat strips of wood!

                    Varnished mahogany is fabulous and I have plans to build a planked yacht based on an IOM design.  It won’t be an IOM because I already have one.

                    P1120646

                    The red on is mine, punching hard to windward in Puerto de Andratx.  You can see what I mean about heavy weather and this wasn’t even the small rig out of three.

                    P1070217

                    Later it had a refit and repaint.  It was later, after Russia invaded Ukraine that I noticed it was the Russian flag colours but at least upside down!  This one is a professionally built Topiko what is a Graham Bantok design.

                    Thank you for your comments.

                    Tim

                     

                    #119876
                    Tim Rowe
                    Participant
                      @timrowe83142

                      On with the build and to set up the frames on the building board.  Ray’s method of extending the frames up / or down (whichever was you look at it) to a common datum helps a lot.  He did leave out the transom and seeing as that was pretty important to support the aft end of the keel, it had to be worked out.  Actually it was a fairly simple piece of projection as we both made the transom flat and then curved it by adding a balsa sheet to sand to shape.

                      DSC01545

                      Here is the projected transom and if anyone else fancies building Eventide I can send the drawing as a pdf with a scale for reference.  It did work out more or less spot on.

                      Some people glue pieces of wood to the frames to screw to the building board.  I am a wood miser so mine are glued direct with aliphatic.  Being Lite PLy they broke off very easily when the came came to release and some quick sanding of the glue spots restored the board like new.

                      P1000375

                      You can see the station marks drawn on the board to get everything lined up.  The marker holes in the keel where the other points of reference and the little right angled brackets held the frames up square to the board.  In this way all the warps in the ply were taken out and everything went into place quite well.

                      Inevitably there was a bit of fairing up to do.  I really think it is worth taking some tine over the fairing.  It make everything much easier when applying the skins. Also important to keep everything symmetrical.  A waterline marker is very useful for checking the chine heights are the same both sides and it is easy to measure out from the keel to make sure the width is the same.

                      A trick I learned from building model aircraft and sanding the wing ribs was to protect the parts you don’t want sanded.
                      P1000382

                      Here you can see I have started at the bow and all the other frames are protected.  When you start to rub into the tape you know it is time to stop!

                      The deck stringers wouldn’t go round the tight curve at the bow and so had to be persuaded by making the saw cuts.  It is best to make the saw cuts progressively deeper as you move away from the bulkhead.  If you don’t you get a sharp bend at the bulkhead and the rest tends to be straight.  It is quite easy to fine tune this by gradually deepening the cuts and seeing how it bends by pulling in at the bow. If there is a tendency to go straight cut a fraction deeper. It sounds like a lot of work but it is probably only two of three trial cuts and I think it is worth it.

                      Nearly ready for skinning which is a great moment turning the skeleton into a boat.

                      Tim

                      #119882
                      Ray Wood 3
                      Participant
                        @raywood3

                        Hi Tim,

                        Yes I was a lazy bugger not showing the transom !! I think in the rush I forgot to draw round the projected shape once established 🙂 I think the rake angle phased me for some reason when I drew the plans .

                        Your precision building puts mine to shame but as long as your enjoying it ! such an all time classic I almost think twice that size would be nice !! Dreaming again, I still have the Howards Way Spring 25 on the drawing board along with lots more ideas 🙂

                        All the best from the UK

                        Ray

                        #119899
                        Tim Rowe
                        Participant
                          @timrowe83142

                          Hello Ray

                          Looking forward to seeing the Spring 25 as it might be another build although I am still intrigued by that Mirror dinghy.  I can’t see myself building any more motor boats after finishing off the 2 Cary 32s and a Billing Nordkap.

                          I am loving the Eventide and Wild Duck builds and I agree twice the size would be fun. Space though! Where to keep them all?

                           

                          Eventide GA

                          I found this GA of Eventide online and seeing as I made a mistake (more of that later) with the positioning of the break in the deck, I might go for this style of saloon window.  I am going to make templates of both before I decide and take it from there before cutting the cabin sides.  I am also tempted by the bowsprit especially if there is any tendency for weather helm.  I think my hull is turning out quite light so I can trade this for extra lead so the increased sail area should be OK.  I am really looking forward to making the spars and  the sails.  Cloth already obtained from Frank Parsons at Nylet.

                          Tim

                          #119903
                          Tim Rowe
                          Participant
                            @timrowe83142

                            Sheeting the hull was done with medium hard 1.5mm balsa because decent thin ply at the correct size is hugely expensive to ship in.  It enables me to get around the tight bends at the bow without using blocks and it is a pleasure to sand.  One of my very few pate hates is sanding the edges of plywood.  I really hate doing it!!

                            P1000568

                            Here the bottom panels are followed by the side panels.

                            P1000569

                            At at last, liberated from the building board including a rather large, yet to cut down transom.

                            The little shoring piece at the bow was to hold the stringer in a better shape while I applied epoxy into the cut slots. As soon as the epoxy cured, the shore was knocked out.

                            As Ray sensibly suggests, now is the time to make a stand.

                            Tim

                             

                             

                            #119907
                            Ray Wood 3
                            Participant
                              @raywood3

                              Hi Tim,

                              I think your GA maybe a later stretched version with the bowsprit ?

                              I will dig out my Building Chine Boats later and compare the drawing I have which is the version on the sail plan, just off to a Classical music concert at Rochester with my daughter Helen who will be 44 on Saturday 🙂 where do the years go ?

                              Best Ray

                              #119908
                              Tim Rowe
                              Participant
                                @timrowe83142

                                Looking at the plan again Ray I think you are right.  Going to stick with the as-drawn windows.

                                Enjoy the concert.

                                Tim

                                #119944
                                Tim Rowe
                                Participant
                                  @timrowe83142

                                  Ray’s next piece of good advice is to build a decent stand so here we go.

                                  P1000573

                                  A couple of templates in scrap balsa taken from the positions I want the supports.  The extension pieces were so that I could mark on a more accurate vertical centreline.

                                  P1000571

                                  Next, pin the MDF pads in the positions they are going to support the hull.  Easy with balsa, not so east with ply where I probably would have used a tiny piece of double sided tape.

                                  P1000574

                                  Pads and supports tacked in place with some rapid epoxy while upside down on the hull and then secured with a bead of epoxy / micro-balloons paste.  The taped edges keep the beads nice and uniform and the tape should be removed just before the mix is fully hardened.

                                  It goes without saying that the height of the supports should be carefully measured to ensure that when in the stand, the boat sits on the corrected waterline because that it the main reference.

                                  This will be the utility stand and I shall probably come up with something quite different for display.

                                  Tim

                                   

                                   

                                  #120002
                                  Tim Rowe
                                  Participant
                                    @timrowe83142

                                    A break from the hull while I made the rudder.  Scale rudders on model yachts don’t work very well unless in very light winds and with the boat upright.  I learned that with the original Galileo over 50 years ago. Eventides rudder is deeper and this time I am deviating from Ray’s plans by making it removeable.  It can then come out for transport, like the keel and for display I might make a second, scale rudder.  The heel fitting on the skeg was cut off.

                                    P1000576

                                    Here is the extended rudder and the rudder tube.  The top part of the rudder is scale but it is nearly 4 times deeper.   The rudder stock is brass tube which conveniently fits neatly inside the other tube.

                                    As the rudder has now been turned into a spade rudder and has no support from the skeg I was a bit concerned about the tube collapsing in the case of a mishap.  I had a carbon rod that neatly fitted inside so it was bonded in place with epoxy making the rudder stock solid.  This will also resist the pinch screw on the tiller arm when I get around to it.

                                    The rudder tube goes right to the bottom of the skeg and a good part of it was filed away just leaving a semi-circular channel.  This is glued and pinned to the skeg for mutual support and the rudder stocks nests securely but freely in the channel giving a bit more support especially laterally.

                                    The rudder is a a high-build spray primer ready for finish painting later.

                                    Tim

                                    #120015
                                    Chris Fellows
                                    Participant
                                      @chrisfellows72943

                                      Hi Tim

                                      Good to see you back on the forum with your meticulous builds which always include some good tips. Seeing the pictures of Eventide reminds me I must start my Fairey Fisherman 27 at some point, though I don’t know when I will be returning to modelling yet having done nothing since  Christmas. Only thing I have done is collect all the motors, servos, servo horns, ESC’s and Rx’s whilst I still can for all my builds. The Hitec Rx I use for example are now in short supply since Hitec stopped manufacturing Tx’s. Oh, there was one other thing, I altered my Huntsman 31 drawings for a guy on another forum who wanted to build a 60″ version!

                                      “No more motor boats” – any plans for the Spearfish?

                                      I’m with you as regards the sanding of plywood edges, bloomin’ hard work and I’ve even worn out one of my Perma-Grit blocks!

                                      Ray – you mentioning the inclined transom. After spending 40 years on the drawing board I find things like that so much easier to draw on the computer nowadays. My drawings for Fisherman and Faun would have so much more difficult than they were.

                                      Chris

                                      #120016
                                      Tim Rowe
                                      Participant
                                        @timrowe83142

                                        Hi Chris

                                        Oh I forgot, yes one more motor boat but that is a classic.

                                        Going to watch the Fisherman when you get going again

                                        Tim

                                        #120024
                                        Ray Wood 3
                                        Participant
                                          @raywood3

                                          Hello Chris,

                                          It seems that the three musketeers are back You , Tim and me 🙂

                                          I find if you wire brush across the Permagrit block it unclogs it and it’s good for another 10 models, one of the best tools I have 🙂

                                          This Biplane is taking ages !!

                                          Regards RayDH Moth 020424

                                          #120025
                                          Tim Rowe
                                          Participant
                                            @timrowe83142

                                            My Permagrits sometimes get clogged with resin and I have found applying acetone with a brush to stop it going everywhere, and then wire brushing works well.  Beware though. It will remove the printing on the label!

                                            As my sailing is done in open water (always launching from a lee shore so the boat will drift back in the event of any failure) it can get a bit rough even from passing boats.  I decided therefore to make the cockpit self-draining.

                                            P1000927

                                            Tis is the underside of the cockpit sole.  The tubes were taken from my fuel tank stock from model aircraft stuff as they were already bent at roughly the right angle.  As the Liteply sole is only 3mm, blocks were added to provide extra support mainly required when I get to fit the silicon tubes for the drains. The stiffener at the fore was to give support because it does not land on a frame.

                                            P1010057

                                            Here is the top surface and for the fittings I used brass spacers that are used in mounting servos.  These have a nice flange and were soldered onto the bras tube.  Flanges however stick up from the surface so they were let into small recesses that were them carefully filled with epoxy taking care not to get any down the holes.

                                            The cockpit sole slopes forward slightly and hopefully I have put then a close as possible into the forward corners.

                                            In practice I don’t suppose they will make much difference but it was fun to do.

                                            Tim

                                             

                                            #120026
                                            Chris Fellows
                                            Participant
                                              @chrisfellows72943

                                              I did buy some special stuff to clean files etc. but I think with that one block it’s just worn out as it’s done some serious work, others are Ok.

                                              I’ll get another one and use that block for lighter work. I need to stock up on glues etc. As well as they have either run out or gone past their best. And remind myself how to build!!

                                              Chris

                                              #120098
                                              Tim Rowe 1
                                              Participant
                                                @timrowe1

                                                Another slight departure from the plan is the rudder servo.  I was concerned about access having it right aft so I have chosen to mount the servo with access from the main hatch and use a “snake” from my model aircraft to connect it to the tiller.  The problem to solve was a very right bend necessary near the rudder which simply would not work.  The solution was to us a bell crank and a short link to the tiller arm.

                                                 

                                                P1000929

                                                After working out angle I fixed a hard plywood plate glued to the frame and to the transom.  Hard plywood was selected because I want to drill and tap it for the swivel bolt.  It would be very hard to get a nut on the underside of the plate.
                                                P1010054

                                                Later with its first coat of paint and the aft bulkhead of the cockpit in place.  The central round hole is so that I can access the grub screw hold the tiller arm onto the rudder stock.  It will be covered with a self-adhesive patch in use which I can peel off when removing the rudder.  The rectangular hole is where the snake passes through but because space is so tight the ball joint will need clearance as well.  At the ends of the travel the snake will move laterally and that is why I have a slot rather than a hole.

                                                Tim

                                                #120125
                                                Tim Rowe 1
                                                Participant
                                                  @timrowe1

                                                  Onto the deck and again it is balsa.  The sheet was a fraction too narrow to get the whole of one side covered so a small section was glued on.  It is easier to glues the extra piece on on top of a board.  I have a small building board, faced with cork and with a strip of white parcel tape run across it to stop anything sticking. It works very well.

                                                  P1010064

                                                  P1010067

                                                  The surplus edge is easily trimmed and sanded off.  Because there is a join on the centreline I have a longitudinal to support the edge.  Not on Ray’s plan because he covers the deck in one piece.

                                                  Starting to look and feel like a boat now.

                                                  Tim

                                                  #120207
                                                  Tim Rowe 1
                                                  Participant
                                                    @timrowe1

                                                    With the deck on, it is time to do the coamings around the aft deck which are one of the defining features of Eventide.

                                                    As Ray says, it is no use tracing the plan and templates need to be made.  The coaming joins the topsides at an angle and is curved to fit the resultant of the sheer in profile and plan view.

                                                    I am a great believer in jigs.  It means you can do dry fits, making little adjustments before finally committing with glue.  Brackets and temporary supports are used a lot in steel shipbuilding where they are simply welded on and ground off later.  A similar system works in wood too.

                                                    P1010072

                                                    Here you an see small scrap pieces of balsa glued on edge to the topsides. Another small piece of scrap was then glued to the first but this time vertical.  These support the coaming truly vertical during the fitting process because any variation from vertical affects the curve on the lower edge.

                                                    P1010073

                                                    The forward brackets have already been cut off and a light sanding removes all traces of glue.

                                                    P1010074

                                                    The forward end of the coaming was located by gluing a small scrap piece onto the raised topsides with the coaming sliding inside.  This ensures that the external surface is flush.

                                                    By this stage the bottom panel of the hull had their glass / epoxy coating to protect the balsa.  The boat goes on and off the stand loads of times and I am sure I would otherwise have put a hole in it.

                                                    Tim

                                                     

                                                     

                                                    #120257
                                                    Tim Rowe 1
                                                    Participant
                                                      @timrowe1

                                                      I don’t have easy access to sheet mahogany to make the cabin sides so I have to make my own.  I do have quite a few good offcuts from big boats that I can slice into 2mm planks using the Proxxon FET table saw.  I then glue them edge to edge using aliphatic because of its quick grab and easy to sand properties.

                                                      P1010161

                                                      I do have a number of small cork-faced building boards (model aircraft builds) and a strip of parcel tape makes a perfect non-stick surface.

                                                      P1010162

                                                      I also have a big stock of wedges and wedge blocks that are great for holding the individual planks on close contact until the glue has completely dried.

                                                      P1010164

                                                      This piece is the front of the cabin.  In any cabin construction the planks will not run out to the corners but finish by rebating into a corner post.  This avoids exposing the end grain.  Putting a plank vertically across the end simulates the corner post.  The same techniques was used for building the main bulkhead and the cabin sides.

                                                      The joints are amazingly strong and behave like a single sheet.

                                                      Tim

                                                       

                                                       

                                                       

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