New Ferries

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

I thought some of you might be intersted in the power setup in the new ferries for Brittany Ferries which are being ordered. The hybrid LNG/electric arrangement offers a lot of versatility to ships which experience constantly differing power demands on relatively short routes. The diagram in the article shows the options and what they can be used for plus the ships can make use of shore power when berthed.

**LINK**

Colin

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

Very interesting power configuration

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

The link seems to take you to a software site Colin!

Ah, second time OK, looks like it was being overwritten by Malware!

Edited By Richard Simpson on 21/07/2021 13:10:30

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

The latest generation of cruise ships are using dual fuel diesel engines with LNG and diesel fuel as the two fuels. Diesel fuel for deep sea and LNG for alongside. The rest of the plant is fairly standard diesel electric set up.

The trouble is that both LNG and diesel fuel are both of a much lower calorific value, especially LNG, than residual fuel so the ships actually need to carry and burn more fuel for a given passage, reducing space available for cabins. Added to that is the significant amount of energy required to maintain the LNG as a liquid and it is easy to see the overall cost of running the ship is going to be a lot higher than it has ever been.

On top of all that Covid is going to force a rethink of the numbers of passengers allowed on ships so profitability is going to take quite a hammering. The cruise and ferry industries are both going to go through some difficult times before things settle down again.

[ashley needhamParticipant @ashleyneedham69188]

Wonder what battery chemistry they will use?

Ashley

[Ray Wood 3Participant @raywood3]

Hi Ashley,

At least a 6 cell Lipo pack !!

Regards Ray

[ashley needhamParticipant @ashleyneedham69188]

I was reading that a lot of manufacturers are trying to develop electric motors without noedidium (or woteva) magnets as 90% of the supply comes from China…ditto battery manufacture. Already a shortage of printed circuit boards (from China).

Ashley

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

Don't be silly Ashley, they don't use batteries for main propulsion, they use an extension cable.

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

Oh and emergency batteries are still good old lead acid up to 2010.

[ashley needhamParticipant @ashleyneedham69188]

Sorry Richard…I can be a bit useless at times….

Ashley

[Colin MillerParticipant @colinmiller68338]

I hope they get to sea quicker than the 2 new LNG Calmac ferries

which are turning into an utter disaster.

One thing that’s been highlighted for these ferries due to be used on the Clyde

the LNG gas is having to be shipped from Scandinavia or Spain using vessels/vehicles powered by diesel

so how much greener are they really?

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

Posted by Colin Miller on 24/07/2021 08:38:23:

I hope they get to sea quicker than the 2 new LNG Calmac ferries

which are turning into an utter disaster.

One thing that’s been highlighted for these ferries due to be used on the Clyde

the LNG gas is having to be shipped from Scandinavia or Spain using vessels/vehicles powered by diesel

so how much greener are they really?

 

 

Always the same with a new technology, not the new units themselves but the support network required to operate them. Look at electric cars.

Ideally the supply of LNG should have been procured first but, if there are no ships to use it at that time, then how are they going to make money back on the investment to install the LNG plant? I agree, to start with the net environmental impact is less than perfect but at least they can now move forward and get to a net zero situation.

I suspect that all LNG ships are going to initially be supplied with fuel carried by diesel powered vessels but soon the supply ships themselves will use the fuel they are carrying, just as many LNG tankers have been doing for many years by using the cargo boil off as fuel in the engines.

Eventually, when the market is established, it will be worth someone's while to build a LNG plant and produce the fuel where it is required.

 

Edited By Richard Simpson on 24/07/2021 09:18:16

[Chris EParticipant @chrise]

It obviously isn't a problem with ferries but with the new LNG cruise liners I wonder how many ports have LNG bunkering facilities. They don't need them in every port but availability might have an impact on cruise schedules – along with the Covid effect + others.

I guess it might be like electric cars. Great idea but be wary of a shortage of recharging facilities.

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

Posted by ashley needham on 21/07/2021 23:06:52:

Sorry Richard…I can be a bit useless at times….

Ashley

Ashley, in the days when I used to work for a more traditional cruise company and we had to attend cocktail parties we used to go back to the Officer's Ward Room afterwards and discus some of the questions we had been asked by passengers.

Some of them were quoted for many years afterwards.

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

Posted by Chris E on 24/07/2021 09:18:57:

It obviously isn't a problem with ferries but with the new LNG cruise liners I wonder how many ports have LNG bunkering facilities. They don't need them in every port but availability might have an impact on cruise schedules – along with the Covid effect + others.

I guess it might be like electric cars. Great idea but be wary of a shortage of recharging facilities.

Even in this day and age there are many ports that either do not have bunkering facilities or, more likely, they do not have the type of fuel that your vessel requires. The itinerary is obviously created to take this into account by the shore side planning team. Not only availability but cost is also factored in as a few of dollars difference on a ton might make a big difference on the total bill.

The big challenge is when a sudden change of itinerary is required, such as hurricane avoidance, and your fuel supply suddenly becomes unavailable. I have had to take fuel from a barge, anchored outside a port, once due to such circumstances.

At the end of the day availability of fuel has to be factored into the itinerary.

I have already mentioned the fact that Covid is going to play a part in ship design in the future, especially cruise ships. This, along with new different fuel requirements, is inevitably going to put the cost up of travelling by sea.

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