Battery life

[Kev.WParticipant @kev-w]

As my Grandad once ( probably more) said ……………….

"Tha' canst paint it any colour tha' wants, but underneath, it's still a plank."

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

Dave,

principles are remembered, but charging rates, ESC amps, battery capacities (true or hopefuls), all that stuff seems to pass me by, but can be looked up, so I'm not too worried.

It was just that original question which suddenly occurred to me when I looked at the various packs of batteries hanging on hooks in the workshop an sitting on shelves in the shed. I'll go back and read that part of the article.

Kip, not sure of the relevance of that Granddadism, but thanks to all generally.

Oh, as luck would have it, my old chum has finally bitten the bullet and bought a newly s/h Futaba 2.4 setup and he tested my sail servo, which works a treat through all 6 turns each way. Tested this afternoon.

Cheers,

Martin

[Kev.WParticipant @kev-w]

"Kip, not sure of the relevance of that Granddadism"

It baffled me at first, but my dad translated it to ……………

"It doesn't matter how you dress it up, It is, what it is".

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

Did you perhaps mean it to go in the varnishing a Riva thread?

Martin

[Kev.WParticipant @kev-w]

No, I was alluding to electrics, some people make it sound like magic by using lots of fancy words & terms, but as long as you can grasp the basics, it's fairly straight forward.

I was a motor mechanic for a number of years, mechanicals, I found came natural to me, I even found air & hydraulic systems not to bad, but when it came to electricals ………………… I'd sooner throw in the towel.

Edited By Kip Woods on 26/04/2016 21:21:57

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

I think that for running model boats you do need to have a basic grasp of electrics as opposed to electronics if for no other reason than to know what to plug into what without frying something. It really isn't rocket science and Dave Milbourn's article in our features section is an excellent primer in that respect.

On the forums we do see people making the same (often expensive) mistakes simply because they were unwilling to do some basic homework.

As people may have noticed on another thread, I have just bought myself a mini lathe. Despite being in the hobby for nearly 60 years I have never previously used a lathe and whilst I knew to some extent what they are capable of, I had only the haziest idea of the lathe components and the way they are used.

But I thought that you can always learn something new so I did a lot of online research and asked advice before deciding on which one to order. Then I bought myself an excellent beginner's book on how to set it up and use it supplemented with a few printouts of other user guides from the internet. OK, it all took a while but I am now confident that I understand the principles of the machine, what all the bits are for and how to go about making simple items. I just need to find time to practice with it to put all this into effect. I don't know just how much I will use it and it is an indulgence but even just getting to this point has opened my eyes to the possibilities that it offers and I have learned a satisfying amount along the way.

Getting back to electrics, it doesn't take much effort to absorb the basics and really that is all you need. Just like with a swimming pool, you can happily splash around in th shallow end without the need to get in over your head.

Colin

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

Ah right, now I get it…and a fellow electro-phobe. I guess we get there in the end with the help of people like the good folks on here.

Martin

[mark69Participant @mark69]

Hi Martin you've said quite a few times you don't understand your instructions for your charger ,as with most things nowadays there's probably a forum for your charger and maybe someone on YouTube showing you how to use it ?? .with your charger have you different plugs for batteries ?simply plug yours into a power source select which type ,choose the ratings and push start and the charger charges !! ,if you are sticking to one type of battery its simple ,My Vista Power EV 650A will charge all batteries used in RC …..the more you do the easier it becomes !! ……happy charging ….mark

Edited By mark69 on 26/04/2016 22:08:25

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

Actually, Colin, it does take a fair bit of effort to absorb the basics of battery charging, storage and usage…for me. Because I cannot get interested in it as a subject, because it's a necessary evil to me, I find it a complete pain to absorb and retain. I will always need articles like Dave's, amongst any others I can get direct info from.

Whereas a small lathe is a right arm to me. I could possibly turn something by sound alone, so familiar am I with the machine. I haven't been without a lathe since I was a teenager. I'm no model engineer, but I'm proud of much which I've been able to make on my many and varied machines over the years and naturally would be only too pleased to help anyone like you with getting the hang of the thing and getting good enough to really enjoy it. My regular shout to my wife, "off over the shed, lathing, love!" means she knows I'll be happy as Larry for however long it takes. Today it was modifying 2 dozen ally wheels for slot racing, because the etchers got the spoke dimensions wrong. Tomorrow it could be a new prop shaft for the steam launch. And then there's using the lathe to make other tools, especially the tools for using on the lathe!

So do please ask if anything at all makes you wonder. It would be only fair that I paid my way for all the good advice on my bete noir!

Cheers,

Martin

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

Martin, I think we all have our phobias to some extent. Personally I hate plumbing. I can do it but I always seem to end up with a frustrating leak somewhere that takes ages to fix.

Steam is also a bit of a mystery to me, again, I get the basics, but working out where to cut the inlet and outlet ports on an oscillator cylinder so that the steam goes in and out in the right order is something of a closed book as far as I am concerned.

With regard to electrics I am fine with basic circuits, volts and amps and electromechanical stuff but definitely in the shallow end of the pool when it comes to electronic circuits. I have a sort of general idea of what goes on inside an electronic speed controller but all I really need to know is whether it is a match for the use to which I wish to put it and how to connect it up. I am also very careful to read the instructions that come with it.

Whilst a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing it can also be very helpful in troubleshooting if you are experiencing problems by enabling you to zero in on the likely cause. It is a similar situation with computer programs. If you know that a package is capable of a particular function then it is just a question of fiddling about until you find out how to do it rather than sitting back, scratching your head wondering if what you want to do is possible at all. A bit of basic knowledge coupled with logical thinking can take you a long way.

Colin

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

Oh Gawd, don't start on computer stuff! I know enough about this thing to use it basically and for internet, but the rest, whatever that may be, forget it. In fat I have only just had my first mobile phone for years thrust upon me and that only makes calls apparently. No pictures, no internet and big buttons<G> It's so my wife can keep tabs on me I think. And, fair enough, in case the heart attack symptoms re-appear I suppose. It has an SOS button. Clever, but I don't want to know how it works. My dad was a plumber, who taught himself electrics and became a radio & TV man. Clever devil! I'd have been happier taking over a plumbing business (I'm an ace solderer!) than the TV one, except I don't do drains (shudder)

Cheers,

Martin

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

Mark,

we have yet to decipher the charger! I looked at the you-tubes that Dave linked to and found one guy couldn't seem to get started and 2 who sounded like they were rehearsing the Muppet Show! I will keep looking for a presenter who doesn't make me want to rip the screen off!

Your charger seems to be similar in pattern to mine.

Martin

[mark69Participant @mark69]

Post a pic of what you have with leads maybe we then can help ??…..mark

Edited By mark69 on 26/04/2016 22:56:51

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

For now I'd be wanting to charge the Nimhs I have. I only tried it with a small LiPo I had bfore, but NiMhs are what I have. However I have nothing that needs charging as I have nothing finished enough, although the article Dave linked to said I should cycle the cells every month or so, which was the original point of the thread as I recall<G>

However I will be asking soon I would think.

Cheers,

Martin

[BRYAN ASTONParticipant @bryanaston57723]

Greetings all

Just a simple question, how long would a 7.2 v battery pack hold a full charge before it would need recharging.

Reading the preceding posts on battery charging as an ex army signaller it is so simple I cannot see the problem,,

Just follow the instructions, and don't stick your fingers in a power socket.

Bryan

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

Bryan,

what instructions? The charger's? Chenglish.

Batteries don't come with any.

Martin

[Malcolm FraryParticipant @malcolmfrary95515]

A large part of the problem is the presence of a smart charger. These are wonderfully versatile, but sadly usually have a display. Sadly because it was created by a guy who was clever at making displays but poor at writing instructions for them so someone who had not designed it could understand it.

I have one or two dedicated SLA chargers for my SLA batteries. Cheap, and they just sit there and work. I have a dedicated simple plug in and charge LiPo charger. It just charges and finishes when it is done. For NiMH and previously NiCad batteries I use a battery eliminator with a high wattage resistor inserted in one leg of the output lead. Total cost is probably about half the cost of an original (as opposed to clone) super-smart charger. Not as fast, not as cool looking, but it all works.

Incidentally, on my old firm small Nicads were in much use – they were stored in a "charging dispenser" which was basically a chute with a rail each side with a standing DC voltage. The batteries were plugged into a box that fitted the chute and dropped into the top. Contacts on the box got volts from the rails, current was limited by a resistor in the box, as long as the battery had more than one day in the chute, it would be fully charged. When wanted, the one at the bottom was removed and everything moved down one. If it got left in there for a few weeks or months, no harm.

Just on general principles, I cant think of any batteries that benefit from being left discharged. NiCads could be stored discharged if they were discharged by an external circuit rather than just being left – bringing them back to life was a long, convoluted process.

[Dave MilbournParticipant @davemilbourn48782]

Martin

I might have offered to buy one of these and write up an article about how to use it, but from the sound of it you have probably bought a clone if you paid only £20 new. The real Sky RC Imax B6 has a hologram sticker on the back of the case which contains a 6-digit number. With this you can validate the origin of the unit by visiting the Sky RC website and entering the number into a dialog box. Clones are known to overcharge batteries which can fatally damage them or even cause fires – and there are more fake B6's for sale on the Internet than real ones. There are also now two versions of the B6; the original B6 and the B6 V2 Pro. I would imagine that the mode of operation is similar between the two but that the later version offers extra functions which, of course, would make it even more complicated.

I would suggest you put that charger aside and use a simpler type which doesn't require any input from you other than the number of cells and a charge rate (e.g. 300 or 600mA). I own and can recommend one of these **LINK**

NiMH cells up to 3000maH should be charged at the lower rate, and cells of more than 3000maH at the higher one. The charger is fully automatic and will switch to trickle mode once it senses that the pack is full. According to one reviewer there are over 50 of these in use at one club! CompShop also sell dedicated 'single-purpose' chargers for LiPo and SLA batteries.

As you have found, a unit which will do all types of batteries is bound to be complicated and is therefore a bad choice for someone with an aversion to technology.

Remember KISS…

Dave M

(Malcolm posted his comments above while I was still writing this! His advice is always worth consideration)

Edited By Dave Milbourn on 27/04/2016 10:30:57

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

So, it seems that even if I did understand all the display stuff, the charger might be likely to ruin the batteries? Great!

I wish I'd known about those dedicated ones at the time. I think I'll stick with my wall chargers for the NiMhs I have and get a lead acid one. I'm unlikely to be using LiPos in the foreseeable future.

I like Malcolm's attitude! And agree with him about the display designers.

Maybe I can sell the smart charger since it's never actually been used! Only unpacked once.

Martin

[Tim CooperParticipant @timcooper90034]

Can anyone recommend a good charger for NiMh batteries? I need to be able to charge up to 10 cells (12v). I have looked

at the digital ones such as the the Giant Power at Component Shop but am not sure I would use all the features and not planning to use LiPo. I would like an automatic so at least it turns itself off.

Thanks

Tim

[Malcolm FraryParticipant @malcolmfrary95515]

I would be tempted to attack a power unit for a laptop* or printer with enough extra voltage, and limit it with a nice big high wattage resistor. But then, I had a working life using pointy pliers and a soldering iron. Again, my preference is not for fast charging, so the need for auto shut-off is reduced.

*I mended a dead portable fridge using one to replace the original power unit that had given up. It has now run longer on the laptop power unit than it did on the manufacturers original.

Dave – many thanks for the compliment, but I do reserve the absolute right to be as wrong as anybody else.

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

"Nice big high wattage resistor". Seems a major component in your armory, Malcolm, but what does it do?

Martin

[Dave MilbournParticipant @davemilbourn48782]

Tim
Click on the LINK in my last reply.

Martin
"High wattage resistors"? There be dragons for you, m'duck – avoid.

Malcolm
I know that, but I reserve the right not to tell anyone when I think you are…

DM

[Martin Field 1Participant @martinfield1]

Oi'll 'ave yew know, moi lad, I used to know all the colour values for resistors when I was a lad, including the percentage, er….doo-dahs on the ends. I had to know this to hand a correct one to my Dad when he was soldering them in a board. AND, I could find a PC 85 in the boot of an Austin Westminster as quick as a Mullard rep himself!

Martin

[Tim CooperParticipant @timcooper90034]

Dave

Thanks, will get one or maybe two on order.

Tim

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