I have never built a boat before!!

I have never built a boat before!!

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  • #99398
    Bryan B
    Participant
      @bryanb82656

      Hi all,

      I have never built a model boat before, however I have but many model aircraft, and flown them.

      So my son is very interested in boats, and i was thinking of building a basic model but I need soe advice for engines etc.

      So I was planning on using the old controllers for my model aircraft, but I have only used gas engines, never electric. So The first thing I need to find out is how do I get the servo receiver to send a signal to a motor to run at a certain speed.. Currently the servos I have are a direct control fro the controller sticks, but this wont work with a motor.

      I have read about a speed controller, but i am new to this and electric motors.

      So if anyone could offer some advice, and point me in the direction where I could but the kit, two motors with shafts and props, and a way to connect them to my servo receiver.

      I will post a pic of my equipment tomorrow, (its blowing a gale outside), and hopefully i can move forward.

      To be honest the outcome of the model is not important, but the experience for my son is more of the aim.

      MAny thanks for your help.

      Regards

      B.

      #3050
      Bryan B
      Participant
        @bryanb82656

        Looking for advice for a project for my son

        #99408
        Colin Bishop
        Moderator
          @colinbishop34627

          Hi Bryan,

          Welcome to the Forum.

          Before saying anything else, if your aircraft control gear is on the 35MHz frequency using crystals then it is illegal for surface use where the corresponding frequencies are 27Mhz and 40Mhz. However most people now use 2.4GHz sets which are reasonably priced and suitable for aircraft, boats and cars.

          I would recommend that you read this article on model boat electrics which explains all the basics and skills needed:

          **LINK**

          and this one which explains speed controllers:

          **LINK**

          You imply you have already bought a kit, If you tell us which one it is then we can probably make specific recommendations. Having two propellers may complicate the electronics a bit depending on the type of model and whether you need mixing functions.

          Colin

          #99409
          Dave Cooper 6
          Participant
            @davecooper6

            Hi Bryan

            Speaking as a relative beginner myself, I would agree with Colin – best to keep it simple to start with. Perhaps, a tug kit with one electric motor, one ESC (Electronic Speed Controller) and one 2.4 GHz receiver. Just add a servo for rudder and you are in business….

            The ESC will need to be matched to the type of motor – brushed or, brushless.

            If you have an old 35 MHz Tx from your aircraft use, you can often buy a 'plug-in' module to convert it to 2.4 GHz.

            There are plenty of experts on the forum to guide you further.

            Regards,

            Dave

            #99416
            Bryan B
            Participant
              @bryanb82656

              Hi Colin, Dave,

              Many thanks for your help, much appreciated.

              I actually havnt bought a kit, I will be making a hull from fibreglass wrapped around foam to get the shape. I have built a few aircraft models using this technique, and use wooden ribs and stringers to provide support.

              Once I have the shape, I create a mould, so I can whip up a new part if it got damaged (with the aircraft this can happen a lot more!)

              I wasnt aware of the legalities of the ban of the older equipment, a few old timers in the model club fly with them using the peg board. I was hoping to just connect a speed controller and allow the elctric motor run through the original equpiment. I have 5 crystal sets of varying frequencies, with 2 spare, i was hoping to use one of these.

              Is that ban for competitions? or what is the reasoning behind this? We have a small pond out the back of our garden, and this is where my little lad wanted to use it.

              The electrics are basically the same, except with the boats weight is what you want for the waterline, but the aircraft, it the opposite, weight will kill a model!

              I will look into the 2.4ghz controllers, but from what I am seeing, the speed controller connects into the servo port of the receiver, and then with its own power supply, sends current to the electric motor in proportion to the servo power, eg the movement on the throttle. Do I have that right?

              Is there a good online store where I could find good starter kits for the motors, props, shafts, speed controllers, and batteries?

              I am trying to make this an educational project for my son, and to be honest, I dont want to fork out hundreds of pounds in equipment for something that could be a dust collector on the shelf in a year!

              Thanks again for all the help, it is much appreciated.

              Bryan

              #99417
              Richard Simpson
              Moderator
                @richardsimpson88330

                Hi Bryan, The ban is on all surface use so you cannot use a model aircraft radio set that uses 35mhz with either boats, tanks or cars at any time.

                Having said that you can get a very respectable 2.4ghz set for a very reasonable price nowadays with a receiver included so the only other bits you would need are a steering servo and a speed controller.

                As regards the basic set up, yes the speed controller will plug into the receiver port, usually channel 1 will be the throttle. You want a speed controller that is reversible, which of course all aircraft ones are not. The receiver can either be powered by a speed controller that has a battery elimination circuit so it also provides power to the receiver, or you can use a separate receiver battery supply. Either way it should be switched and you should have a suitable sized fuse on the main battery positive side.

                Steering servos simply plug into any other convenient proportional channel, usually the right hand stick left and right is used.

                This is a very basic layout diagram that you might find useful, using a speed controller with a battery elimination circuit, the elimination refers to the receiver battery:

                basic layout.jpg

                 

                Edited By Richard Simpson on 06/02/2022 19:31:19

                #99418
                Colin Bishop
                Moderator
                  @colinbishop34627

                  Bryan,

                  Depending on what you want to build, assuming it is fairly small, typical commercial ball park pricesfrom UK suppliers would be;

                  Radio transmitter plus receiver: £44

                  Rudder Servo £5:

                  One motor: £7

                  Coupling to propshaft: £5

                  Speed Controller: £25

                  Battery: £15 plus you will need a charger.

                  Propshaft & tube: £8

                  Propeller: £10 for brass, less for plastic.

                  Rudder: £8

                  You can shave a bit off these prices if you know exactly waht you want or are willing to order from Chinese suppliers.

                  Rather more bits needed than for an aircraft really.

                  This should give you a general idea of the overall cost ovver and above the boat itself.

                  Colin

                   

                   

                   

                  Edited By Colin Bishop on 06/02/2022 19:55:50

                  #99423
                  redpmg
                  Participant
                    @redpmg

                    Some 35mhz RC Equipment does work with 40mhz crystals – both my Hitec 3 channel sets do – although 40mhz crystals are getting hard to find nowadays . That would be legal to use – but the 2.4ghz 2 channel sets are now low priced so that may well be a cheaper option- especially  looking at what some want for 40mhz crystals on eBay & elsewhere. Apparently in demand for submarines as 2.4ghz does not work well for those.

                    Sent you a PM.

                     

                    Edited By redpmg on 07/02/2022 12:14:19

                    #99432
                    ashley needham
                    Participant
                      @ashleyneedham69188

                      lcm flackBryan. I have used the fibreglass on foam method a few times, however, most of the foam was either left in place, or scratched out. You are very unlikely to need another remoulded part for your boat unless you build it much too flimsily, or someone treads on it!

                      Colins summation of costs is very typical and what makes your first build expensive, the next boats cost is much reduced simply to spending on running gear and a receiver/esc.

                      I can make one of our 22ish inch landing craft in one warm sunny afternoon, including an all over coat of grey primer for probably 8 quids worth of 4mm ply, but that would translate to 128 quids worth from a standing start…

                      Ashley

                      #99438
                      Bryan B
                      Participant
                        @bryanb82656

                        Hi folks,

                        firstly thank you very much for all the advice and help. I have made a few enquiries, but everyone wants to know the weight and scale.!

                        I cant really give that information until I build it.

                        I was considering buying the prop shafts so I can build the hull, and have the sleves for the shafts installed in the process.

                        So for the moment the only thing I need to ask is what size shaft should I buy? M4 seems to the listed a lot.

                        Any thoughts on the ideas?

                        Thanks again

                        Bryan

                        #99439
                        Colin Bishop
                        Moderator
                          @colinbishop34627

                          M4 is generally OK for most boats unless you are building very big or very small. When installing the prop tube you will need to make sure that there is enoiugh clearance under the hull for the biggest prop you are likely to use.

                          Colin

                          #99442
                          Bryan B
                          Participant
                            @bryanb82656

                            Hi Colin,

                            I was planning on having the prop shaft mid way between the keel and the bottom of the hull, so I will then have the maximum available equal distance.

                            Ill order the M4 shaft, and start the hull. Once I have that made, then at least I can get an idea of what motors to install, and from there batteries etc.

                            I suppose once I have the hull watertight, and waterline marked, I could weigh it with ballast to get it to sink to the waterline, and then weigh the model. With the dimensions, the amount of hull below the waterline, and the total weight, would that be enough for the experts here to advise on a size or type of motor/prop combination?

                            As I stated before, this is all just a bit of fun, and a bit of an education for my 7 year old. It may never see water, but I would like to give it a chance!

                            Thanks again for all of your help.

                            Bryan

                            #99443
                            Trevor Drabble 1
                            Participant
                              @trevordrabble1

                              Bryan , May l suggest you look at SHG Marine on eBay. Graham and Sue have always been most helpful , and they put an explanitary note on Mayhem when they decided to go the eBay route , and in that note , they explained that they would recommend suitable additional products to go with any purchase. I haven't checked their present range , but they used to supply everything you may need. and then some , including radios , speed controllers , simple boat kits etc.

                              I hope you find this proves helpful.

                              #99444
                              redpmg
                              Participant
                                @redpmg

                                See new PM

                                #99445
                                ashley needham
                                Participant
                                  @ashleyneedham69188

                                  Bryan. i would make the hull first before buying propshafts and so on, as the style of boat you end up with will have a bearing on where you put and how long the propshaft will be. A light cabin cruiser affair will need a different requirement to a deep draught vessel…tug etc.

                                  Another requirement is to keep the battery and propulsion items low for stability.

                                  Ashley

                                  #99447
                                  Ray Wood 3
                                  Participant
                                    @raywood3

                                    Hi Bryan,

                                    Another suggestion on from Ash's is to do a simple drawing of what your going to build so you will know what length and angle your stern tube & shaft need to be img_20200410_085420.jpgto clear the hull and stay above the keel line, reference to fullsize practice is always good

                                    This is a yacht but a similar sketch works

                                    Regards Ray

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