Futuristic Hydroplane

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29 December 2015 at 20:53 #62349
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Dear All

I have a project to design a very futuristic hydroplane, the brief is that it has to look more like some kind of spaceship rather than a contemporary boat and it has to perform like a modern three point hydroplane. The finished boat is to be no more than 1m long and built in no more than three sections.

I am looking for suggestions and advice.

Paul
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29 December 2015 at 20:53 #7053
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
29 December 2015 at 21:26 #62350
Tony Hadley
Participant
@tonyhadley
Came across these old hydroplane designs in a plans handbook from yesteryear. Could any of these designs be worth updating?
30 December 2015 at 09:40 #62353
ashley needham
Participant
@ashleyneedham69188
Tony. Some nice boats;. I see that a lot of them, or probably MOST of them were for non r/c, and even "free running" ???? (on a hydro going that fast !!). This would make updating tricky, as well as attempting to specify the size of brushless/prop/airscrew combination.

That's not to say that one or two may not fit the Paul T bill. A few really great lookers there. Scooter looks like something out of Fireball XL5 for instance.

Paul. Are any and all propulsions systems fair game….screw, air-prop or EDF?

Ashley

Edited By ashley needham on 30/12/2015 09:49:47

Edited By ashley needham on 30/12/2015 09:51:58
30 December 2015 at 11:22 #62356
Tony Hadley
Participant
@tonyhadley
After uploading the pictures, I also thought "Scooter" looked good and must agree with you Ashley. The canopy could present problems to mould. Whether Paul requires a airscrew or a propeller could influence the looks, where the motor is located on the top of the rudder/aerofoil could be modified to a futuristic wing should a water prop be the design brief.

Fireball XL5 – that brings back memories, Steve Zodiac and his crew and a lovely theme tune by Barry Gray.
30 December 2015 at 11:36 #62357
Colin Bishop
Moderator
@colinbishop34627
It seems that you have the choice of 'Retro' future which is all curves in the Dan Dare mould or 'modern' future which is likely to be all flat surfaces like the Zumwalt. Nostalgia wins for me and I like the Scooter design too.

Some Dan Dare inspiration can be found here: http://www.dandare.org/

Colin

Edited By Colin Bishop, Website Editor on 30/12/2015 11:40:01
30 December 2015 at 15:18 #62365
ashley needham
Participant
@ashleyneedham69188
The more I look at the pictures, the more I see that's very interesting. The "Kwik-Kwak" rubber band powered Hydro.." Fast and amusing" for one. Scudder, would look good in fake aluminium finish, Ah..

Retro future does it for me. May be issues with getting some of them to work with modern motors and so on ??

The john Cobb Crusader is quite futuristic, and a workable design. Iain at the pond has made one (see my snaps) from a fibreglass mould wot he has made (as he is very clever) , and it looks dead good. it sits nose down with masses of spray (I think it was?) until moving quick and a bit prone to skipping, but apparently footage of the real one shows this tendency as well. All my Ecranoplan thingies sit oddly in the water until moving fast, there is such a change of trim when moving, especially when the air screw drive is high..

Ashley
30 December 2015 at 17:07 #62372
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
The artwork on Asimov books is the only clue so I am looking at the work by Chris Foss for inspiration.
30 December 2015 at 20:03 #62378
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
These are the kind of thing that I am thinking about.

Paul
31 December 2015 at 11:32 #62388
ashley needham
Participant
@ashleyneedham69188
Oo er. A horrible concept to try and design..all those curves! All the made-up detail to include to make the craft "real".

Seems like a job for sculpted Styrofoam at least for the outriggers. Failing that, I have used a flat carcass and stuck thinnish foam over the top and sculpted this. The carcass gives rigidity and internal space for gear, the foam allows curves without planking some over ribs…?
Ashley
31 December 2015 at 12:05 #62389
Dodgy Geezer 1
Participant
@dodgygeezer1
'Futuristic' always reminds me of the 'Futurism' artistic craze of the 1910s/20s. Vehicle shapes influenced by this turned up in the 1930s/40s – so Buck Rogers and Flash Gordon spring to mind…

Buck Rogers Images

Flash Gordon Images
31 December 2015 at 12:54 #62390
Dave Milbourn
Participant
@davemilbourn48782
Gordon's alive???

Sorry, Paul – can't help with this one, mate.

Dave M
31 December 2015 at 16:53 #62391
Dodgy Geezer 1
Participant
@dodgygeezer1
Dave,

We love you, but we only have 14 hours to save Paul T's project….

(cue Queen…) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MS4_Z84-rRE

Edited By Dodgy Geezer on 31/12/2015 16:55:30

Edited By Dodgy Geezer on 31/12/2015 16:56:38
31 December 2015 at 18:29 #62398
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
This particular project is bringing me great enjoyment not only from the practicalities of designing such a weird model but being able to revisit the images that populated my youth. I was raised on a diet of Gerry Anderson, futurism art and science fiction (both books and film) and would often while away a triple English lesson by doodling designs on the back of exercise books.

I am wallowing in all of the Buck Rogers, Flash Gordon and even Dan Dare images and I am running the risk of concept overload.

Ash:

Already done the Cobb boat as another 'project' but I am really warming to this shape

As you say there are lots of curves but they don't necessarily need to be curves as some very intriguing shapes can be made from straight lines, angles and long thin triangles.

Tony

Still have to find the space for all the gear (probably in a dinghy towed behind the model) Fireball and SuperCar..happy days

DG / Colin

Thanks for the links and have you looked at Retro- Futurism, where the futurism designs of the 20s have influenced todays modern machines.

Dave

You will be able to help old son.

Paul
31 December 2015 at 18:35 #62399
ashley needham
Participant
@ashleyneedham69188
Paul has a difficult brief here, and I would suggest sticking to a sub-surface conventional drive (albeit via a flexi-drive) so as to reduce the number of unknowns in a futuristic design such as this will be.

Sub surface may not be the fastest, but it will propel anything at a good speed with sufficient power. Surface drives are a nightmare, especially with something unconventional, and props or EDF may demand more power or much experimentation to get right.

Ashley Gosh these tights are constricting…
1 January 2016 at 11:46 #62416
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Ash

Go on then why are you wearing tights…..again
1 January 2016 at 12:23 #62418
Colin Bishop
Moderator
@colinbishop34627
That design just begs for an internal paddle wheel….

How more retro could you get?

Colin
1 January 2016 at 12:46 #62420
Tony Hadley
Participant
@tonyhadley
Colin, your mention of an internal paddle wheel meant the old designs of yesteryear had to be looked at again – the Holland paddle-drive. Must modernise the thinking!

Believe this drive system produces a really stunning rooster-tail.
1 January 2016 at 13:48 #62421
Colin Bishop
Moderator
@colinbishop34627
Just goes to show there is nothing new under the sun, probably an interesting effect when in reverse too!

Colin
1 January 2016 at 17:51 #62423
ashley needham
Participant
@ashleyneedham69188
Paul. appertaining to the image you are warming to…which is the front end???

If the left hand side was to be the rear then two surface drive props at the ends would be very trick. Motors in side pods. Gear in waterproof lunch box (Whoops thinking of flash again) in main body.

Tony; Paddle drive. In the very early 1800`s when they were deciding the form of what a steam powered boat should be there was a catamaran design toted….for warships even. Loads of plusses…paddle protected from gunfire, unimpeded sides to mount a full length battery, great stability. A few minuses, probably too many for the available technology.

Ashley
1 January 2016 at 19:50 #62425
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Ash

The left hand side is the front so there is no room for a paddlewheel.

Paul
2 January 2016 at 09:05 #62431
ashley needham
Participant
@ashleyneedham69188
Hmm… the centre "wing" between the front points could be lowered and used as a foil??
Please do not get me muddled up as the suggestor of a paddlewheel!!

Ashley
2 January 2016 at 18:00 #62439
Paul T
Participant
@pault84577
Hi Ashley

The wing would have to be used as a foil simply to prevent it becoming a 'diving plane'. Of course you are the instigator of the paddlewheel and I especially like your proposal of mounting the paddlewheel horizontally.

Paul
2 January 2016 at 19:26 #62441
ashley needham
Participant
@ashleyneedham69188
Paul. I am sorry, you have me completely wrong there, I did not suggest the horizontal wheel, I would only ever use paddle wheels on such an advanced design on the diagonal, as this assists in high speed cornering.

A water jet drive would be appropriate, please see my PM for a paddle jet drive design.

Hmm….the foil COULD be used to get the vehicle under water….get my drift….

Ashley
2 January 2016 at 19:49 #62443
ashley needham
Participant
@ashleyneedham69188
ANYWAY…isn't a horizontal paddle wheel a Voith-schneider unit????? A
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