Glassing a balsa hull

Glassing a balsa hull

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  • #15780
    Peter Nordsjoe
    Participant
      @peternordsjoe33686

      Hi,

      I am in the planning stages of building 1/24 MTB from John Lambert plans. I am pretty clear on how to build the frame but am alittle bit unsure as to the best way of planking it. Since the hull shape is fairly uncomplicated is there a better way of planking than with long thin strips of balsa? ie nice broad pieces?

      I have also understood that in order to avoid the natural flexing and movement of the balsa one needs to add a thin layer of glassfiber on top of it. Any advice as to how to best approach this? I have never glassed before but have "some" theoretical experience!

      Thanks in advance to any one will to share there experience with this ambitious newbie!

      #15781
      Paul T
      Participant
        @pault84577

        Hi Peter

        Yes you can use larger pieces of balsa or even 2mm ply to skin this model the easiest way to cut out the right shapes is to make card templates of how the skin should fit to the frame (once the frame is complete) and then transfer the template shapes onto the wood for cutting.

        The hardest part to skin with larger sheets is the fine flaired section at the bottom of the bow, at this point most model builders don’t try to bend wood round the very tight curves but instead glue in a solid piece of timber / balsa and carve the shape to suit.

        Glassing a hull is never a good idea as it leaves a rough surface and besides if your models frame is rigid enough then the skin should not flex to much.

        Hope this helps

        Paul

        #15782
        ashley needham
        Participant
          @ashleyneedham69188

          Peter. How about glassing the inside to stiffen it up? I have done this with one or two models to (date) no ill effect ??? I do understand one or two modellers like to leave the inside unsealed in order to let any damp in the hul wood dry out. Ashley

          #15784
          Peter Nordsjoe
          Participant
            @peternordsjoe33686

            Thanks Paul I’m releaved to here I shouldn’t bother with glassing. Not sure where I picked it up but I guess the web is full of not so useful information. Thanks for the tip on using card templates.

             What would you suggest to use for the framing material? Ply as well? I imagine balsa to be easier to cut to shape but maybe not as strong as ply, but then maybe it doesn’t need to be once its been planked?

            Thanks again for your quick reply!

            Peter

            #15785
            Peter Nordsjoe
            Participant
              @peternordsjoe33686

              Hi Ashley,

              I don’t know. You think I need it if I use 2 mm ply? I’m not sure what stress the hull will be under when under way. I’m planning on scale speeds.

              Peter

              #15792
              ashley needham
              Participant
                @ashleyneedham69188

                Peter, With 2mm ply probly not, but it might be an option if after finishing the hull you decide a bit more stiffness might be wanted.
                Scale speeds?? no no no. a big fat motor is whats required, its an MTB after all !!! Ashley

                #15793
                Peter Nordsjoe
                Participant
                  @peternordsjoe33686

                  Ashley, I was planning on using two 540 size motors with 7.2 Nicads (left over from the buggy days). Reckon that will be enough given the right props?  

                  #15794
                  Charles Oates
                  Participant
                    @charlesoates31738

                    Hi Peter,

                                I’ve used fibreglass resin inside many balsa hulls and never had any problems, even on hulls 20 years old. I always make sure that I get the resin into all the hiden areas, under the deck, inside the bow etc.

                         As to finishing the outside, there are almost as many ideas as to the best way to do this as there are people doing it. I’ve tried many of them but my favourite is to brush in many coats of thinned varnish. It soaks right down into the wood and helps stabelise it.

                      The balsa hull can be very light and strong, ideal if you want to go quickly.

                     Chas

                    #15795
                    Peter Nordsjoe
                    Participant
                      @peternordsjoe33686

                      Hi Chas,

                      Thanks for the tip, but I want to make sure I understood you correctly.

                      Do you only use the resin without matting? Or both resin and fiberglass?

                      Peter

                      #15796
                      Paul T
                      Participant
                        @pault84577

                        Hi Peter

                        Try using 10mm exterior quality ply for the keel and frames and 2mm ply for the skin, don’t be tempted to nail the skin on but instead use a 2 pack epoxy glue (very strong and won’t come apart if it gets wet) when fixing the skins start from the stern and go slowly forward using clamps to hold the skin in place whilst the glue sets.

                        Paul 

                        #15798
                        Mike Davidson
                        Participant
                          @mikedavidson22772

                          What I do is to construct a skeleton using6mm plyfor the keel (s) and ribs. then 2mm ply and 0.7mmply for the outerskin depending on how many compound curves I want to build in. Having loosly assembled the whole thing, I clamp it together usinglitte spring loaded clothes peg type clamps, spread 5 layers of newspaper on the floor, mix up some glassfibre resin with a 0.85 %mix of hardner so it sets slowly, pour it into the hull like a big soup bowl and swill it around so that it penetrates every little nook and cranny. At this point, I leave it to set, making sure that all hull penetrations are fully sealed like prop shafts and rudder fixings. This is a good time to check that none has gone into the wrong place like the lounge carpet, it’s a good idea to have a little solvent handy, but when the resin sets, the inside of your hull will have a finish like glass, and a watertight integrity to die for   .As capilliary action causes the resin to seep in between the ribs and the outer hull, when it sets your hull will be as rigid as the formula one racing tubs,so all the torque from your motor will be transmitted to the propellor. A tip for you, I keep the caps from aerosol cans to mix my resin in.as is easy to remove when set. I have dozens of 2inch resin disks, but I never throw anything away, you never know when they will cuminandy. There’s nothing so big as a scratch builder’s cuminandy box. You would not believe the things that I have incorporated into my models, they should come with a COSHH DATA sheet

                          #15801
                          Peter Nordsjoe
                          Participant
                            @peternordsjoe33686

                            Hi every one, just want to say thanks for all the advice and tips I have recieved so far. I really appreciate it. Feel free to jott down more of them!

                            Mike, just want to clarify one thing. Do you glass the interior with the fitting already in? I would have thought to do the glassing before drilling any holes.

                            Also, do you use a solid block of wood to shape the compound curves of the bow or is that where the 0.7mm ply comes in?

                            Pete

                            #15814
                            Charles Oates
                            Participant
                              @charlesoates31738

                              Hi again,

                                          I couldn’t put it better than Mike, that’s what works for me.

                               As for the bits/junk box, that’s the most essectial resourse I’ve got. If you ever get chance to strip down an old cine camera, they’re worthless these days, you’ll get some fantastic stuff. The zoom motor & gearbox makes the best radar drive ever.

                               Chas

                              #15829
                              ashley needham
                              Participant
                                @ashleyneedham69188

                                Peter, just to get back to the motor choice, 2x 540`s should be ok, but beware , there are loads of different types at this size, some are really really juicy and inefficient..your buggy ones are likely to be fairly powerful, but I would stick an ammeter on them (no esc, just a battery) to see what current they draw. As to props, it depends whether you want a nice scale set on there or a speedy set. 35mm brass 3 blade props are about right for a 540, may be a touch small looking on your model though. If you choose mounts suitable for 500 and 600 size motors and 4mm shafts, and leave clearance for,say, a 45mm prop size then you will be covered for experimentation on all counts if your initial set up is inadequate. A set of 2-blade race type props would deliver best performance, but tend to draw max amps from the motor. I should get a new set of NiMh cells though, depending on how old your Nicads are they are likely to be past their best now.. A shop person I spoke to rated the Graupner 600ECO motors, as being powerful but not too "ampy" especially if not loaded with too big a propeller.

                                Chas, like the cine camera tip, 

                                Mike, I like the idea of poring in the resin and sloshing around.. i usually paint mine on, but of course you always miss bits like that.   Ashley

                                #16971
                                Peter Nordsjoe
                                Participant
                                  @peternordsjoe33686

                                  Well, I have made some head way since last time. I have built the frame of my 1/24 70ft Mtb in 7mm ply and have decided to plank it as (sort of) per the original, with two layers of planking diagonally along the frame. See an example of what I mean on http://www.pt-boat.com/Hull2/Hull2-35th.html .

                                  The first layer will be balsa and the outer in lime wood – not sure anyone uses lime wood but that is what is apparently available here in my neck of the woods (Sweden). Question is that Chas mentioned above that I should use "thinned varnish" to "stabilize" the balsa. How does one "thin" the varninsh? Also, would this be recommended for lime wood as well? Any thoughts on lime wood also appreciated as the guy selling me the stuff is a propeller head.

                                  Thirdly. Any metals in the constuction should be either brass, aluminum or stainless steel correct?

                                   Thanks for any and all input/ideas.

                                  Peter

                                  #1703
                                  Peter Nordsjoe
                                  Participant
                                    @peternordsjoe33686

                                    How to scratch build an MTB hull

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