Where to get correct color for Bluenose II

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

I am currently building a Bluenose II schooner from a kit. The instructions are quite good but there is no mention on correct colors to paint the hull. There are heaps of images available showing the colors of the hull (one is obviously black and the other is a dark rusty red brown color) for both the models and the real boat.

If anyone has built this boat I would glad to find out what they used

Thanks

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

[Bob WilsonParticipant @bobwilson59101]

There are hundreds of colour photographs of it on the internet here: **LINK**

Black above wataer, red oxide below with a white stripe separating the wo colours.

Bob

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

Thanks Bob

Yes I mentioned that there are heaps of images of the Bluenose II.

Thanks for the color name below the water line but the big problem I have is getting that color in a suitable paint.

I guess I could have acrylic house paint tinted to any color I want but would house paint 'work' on a timber model.

John

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

For red oxide use a automotive primer, preferable a spray can. You can then seal it with satin lacquer or alternatively give it a coat of Ronseal Mattcoat polyurethane varnish.

Halford's Matt Black spray will do very well for the upper hull.

**LINK**

Don't use house paints, they are water based these days and never really go hard so will be susceptible to scratches.

If you are not confident about painting the white stripe accurately then use Trimline vinyl tape which is very thin and will stick well (it's waterproof).

**LINK**

Colin

[Bob WilsonParticipant @bobwilson59101]

I also use Halford's red oxide spray for underwater. Another excellent Halford's black is Satin Black.

Bob

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

Thanks Bob

I 'googled' Halfords paint as I have never heard of it (here in Australia) and the only 'hits' I got were about automotive paint. At Halfords web site I could only find 'red oxide' as a primer paint. I am aware of red oxide paint as a primer but as a finish on a model? I guess maybe overcoat it with a matt or satin clear?

Also most of their paint is aerosol cans?

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

Yes, red oxide is a standard automotive primer colour. It is a very good match for underwater antifouling paint. As stated in my earlier post above you can seal it although it is not strictly necessary.

Spray cans are best as you will get a better finish.

Colin

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

Sorry Colin I did not see your reply as when I clicked on the link in the email it displayed only Bob's reply (yours was off the top of the screen).

Not sure if I will bother with the white line at 'water level' but if I did I would look in an automotive shop for those rolls of stick on 'pin stripe' and hope there is a white one of a suitable width.

Have you seen and threads based on the Billings Boats kits preferably the Bluenose II. This is my very first 'build' and although I have Googled a lot and also found stuff on Youtube I am having some minor 'issues' which hopefully I work out correctly. The instructions which came with the kit are quite detailed but don't explain some things very well and it seems the author expects the reader to be more advanced than I am eg shaping the planks to allow for the bow and after to be more narrow than midships BTW I now consider I know what to do there.

One thing which stands out at this point (just about to start planking) is the pseudo planking of the deck. The plans show the lines drawn but do NOT explain how to do them other than showing a pencil on the plans to denote that the lines are hand drawn using a pencil (I actually used an Artline 220 black pen with a tip of 0.2mm which worked really well and the ink didn't bleed – there's a TIP for everyone) . I ended up using a 'plank' as a gauge to get the lines parallel to each other as I had no idea if there was an easy way to draw bent lines as shown in the plans. In some ways I would have thought that the lines could have been printed on the veneer to make it easy. I know that the deck planking should be 'bent' and shaped at the aft but no one who looks at my model will know the difference.

[Bob WilsonParticipant @bobwilson59101]

I feel sure that Red Oxide is a standard colour world-wide, and is ideal for underwater covering. A spray can gives a perfect finish, and I would never even consider glossing it over. Here is a hull sprayed with red oxide. I just cut the white line from a long piece of high quality paper, and stick it on. Another way is to stick a strip of paper masking tape to a long piece of scrap acrylic and spray it with white matt primer from automobile shop. Cut out the white strip with a scalpel, and you have your own piece of home-made self-adhesive strip. It is very sticky and permanent. As you say, very few people would notice if you got incorrect deck planking! Occasionally, you may get "did you know the deck planking is wrong!" Just say "yes," and leave it at that! without giving any excuse!

Bob

Edited By Bob Wilson on 01/01/2017 07:31:57

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

Thanks Bob for the tips.

One thing though I wondered. And that is automotive (spray) paint is obviously designed to go on metal.

Do I assume that because you and Colin have used it that it sticks ok to wood? And YES red oxide is available as a primer (but usually for metal) here in Australia. Lastly what do you use as a primer on bare timber? I know that red oxide is a primer of sorts (a metal primer) but what do you use as a primer under say other colors which aren't primers?

Gee I like the model you included in your reply. Have you built many?

Edited By John Arnold 3 on 01/01/2017 10:56:43

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

That's OK John. I am not surprised you are having a few issues as Billing kits are known to be a bit 'tricky'.

As you have seem to have realised, the difference in hull depth between midships and the bow and stern means that you you will get gaps when you lay the planking long the hull. The usual means of dealing with this is to introduce 'stealers' which are short tapered lengths of planking which fill those gaps.

I saw Bluenose II when we were in Nova Scotia last summer and have uploaded some of my photos here:

**LINK**

a couple are reproduced below. She is a very impressive vessel and surprisingly large when seen close up.

Colin

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

Great pictures Colin. I have found some of the actual craft but not close up as you displayed. I visited Nova Scotia a couple of years ago and after looking at the videos I took while there I note that indeed I did see the Bluenose II and remembered at the time that I wanted to get closer for closeups but the dock was inaccessible (locked up). At the time little did I know that 3 or 4 years later that I would build a model of it. I must work out how to uploads images to an 'album' and I will include a frame from the video.

Being the first model I am building I had no idea which kit manufacturers were good and which ones not so good or easy. I just wanted a model which didn't come with a preformed hull and one which wasn't for experts. The Bluenose seemed to 'fit' those requirements but after getting it and looking at all the pieces and instructions I nearly had a heart attack. Anyway I'm sure if I research enough and take my time that I will be satisfied with it once completed.

Not sure I understand you with using 'stealers' though especially at the stern where the 23 planks each side need to fit into a 'width' much LESS than at midships and as such the planks will need tapering at the front and rear.. I know what you mean by using 'stealers' to fill in gaps but surely I won't have any. All the instructions state is to "sand the planking strips to taper for and aft'.

Once again thanks for making your replies.

 

Edited By John Arnold 3 on 01/01/2017 11:34:28

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

Yes, you will need to taper your planks as you say. I was thinking of another Billings kit (uncompleted!) where the planks would not follow the curvature of the hull without bending away from the adjacent plank at the ends. It all rather depends on the hull shape really.

I am sure you will make a fine job of the model.

Have a look at the FAQ section bottom right of page for uploading photos.

Colin

[BanjomanParticipant @banjoman]

Hello John,

There are a number of very useful articles available over on the Model Ship World forum that explain at some length how best to go about planking a plank-on-bulkhead or plank-on-frame hull like the one you are building. You'll find the here: **LINK**.

Among other things they explain the, as it were, opposite technique of stealers (also spelled steelers), namely drop strakes, which are used to reduced two planks to one, or three planks to two, where stealers are used to go from one plank to two or two planks to three.

Also explained in some detail are various techniques for spiling the planks, i.e. how to determine the shape of each plank required for it to form a straight edge against which to place the next one, and cutting it to said shape.

Some of the terminology and suggested techniques differ a bit between the various articles, but taken together they provide a lot of useful information on how to plank a hull. My favourite article for clarity is probably this one by David Antscherl (**LINK**) but really I would suggest reading them all! A few hours spent that way may well save you many more hours of frustration during the build …

Good luck and enjoy your new hobby!

Mattias

Edited By Banjoman on 01/01/2017 11:43:17

[Bob WilsonParticipant @bobwilson59101]

Although most of my models are of iron or steel vessels, their hulls are invariably made of wood, and the red oxide spray goes on very well. I usually give three or more coats, as the first two tend to sink into the wood, but the finish is superb after several coats. I have built 270 of them since I started counting in October 1992.

Bob

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

Thanks Mattias for the links.I will read them as I am just about to start my planking.

Bob you are averaging 11 models a year. That is incredible. Where do you keep them all and are any motorised?

What do you use to seal the timber on your models where the top coat is not red oxide?

I just discovered that I in fact saw the Bluenose II at Lunenburg, Nova Scotia when I was there 3 years ago. Little did I realise then that I would build a model of it. I remember thinking that it looked lovely but could not get close as the dock was fenced off but I did get some video of it and have uploaded it to Youtube – when they publish it I will add a link here.

[Bob WilsonParticipant @bobwilson59101]

John,

I used to build about 14 a year, but nowadays am only building two or three! None of them are motorised, they areall static miniatures. I seal the wood with shellac sanding sealer obtained from Ebay. We only have a few completed models, most of them are sold. I do not take private commissions as it is only a hobby. They sell easily enough, as very few modelmakers like building this sort of thing. Here is my last one – it s now in Panama.

Bob

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

Bob,

That model looks fantastic. I have never seen such a small sailing ship model with such detail especially the rigging. Well done.

It begs another question from me. The Bluenose I am building suggests 'lined' sails as in your model.

I am thinking that the lines are made from sewing the sails using a sewing machine. I immediately thought that I would approach a seamstress or place which does clothing alterations to ask if they would do that.Is that how you did it/had it done?

I checked Ebay for shellac sanding sealer but no one in Australia lists it and all the overseas listings work out extremely expensive with postage. I will check with hobby shops in my area. Maybe there is another type of sealer which can be used. Nothing in the instructions which leave a lot to be desired.

[Bob WilsonParticipant @bobwilson59101]

Thanks, if you click on my "photos" to the left under my name, you will see the 164 images currently posted here on Model Boats. The sealer I use is for French polish, and it is called Mylands 2000 Pale Shellac Sealer/Basecoat.

My sails are only white airmail paper, and the seams are printed on in light grey using the computer printer. Light grey is used so they are not too obtrusive. The sails are then given a wind-filled look by mouldin the round an ostrich egg whilst wet, and then edged with fine copper wire. Probabaly not suitable on larger scales.

Bob

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

It seems that you are maybe around my age if that photo of the boy in 1952 is of yourself.

Radio another 'hobby' (ham radio?)

I must check our local hardware store as it is huge and bound to stock shellac based products.

Regarding 'lined' sails – I think I saw something on the internet about using a sewing machine to 'sew' the lines. Just have to find someone willing to do it.

I just remembered that DOPE can be used to seal balsa wood and probably pine too. I used to use that years ago when building model aircraft. It's primary use is to shrink tissue and silk used to cover the wings but it also sealed everything. Even mixed it with wood dust (from sanding) to fill minor holes. Anyway I will check out my nearest hobby shop soon.

[Bob WilsonParticipant @bobwilson59101]

Yes, that is me in the photograph in 1952. I was never a radio Ham, but 8 years after the photo was taken, I qualified as a radio officer in the merchant navy, and remained there until I got fed up of it all in late 1992!

I feel sure that you will be able to find some shellac sealer in Australia. It is normally used as a sealer for French Polish.. Dope would probably work just as well!

Bob

[John Arnold 3Participant @johnarnold3]

Thanks Bob

I remember as a child seeing shellac flakes in my father's garage (who was a cabinet maker by trade) which I think he dissolved in methylated spirits and then applied to timber (french polishing?). I just Googled shellac to find it is a resin secreted by a bug in India. Strange.

I'm sure I will get something suitable to seal with but it was good to learn of what can be used.

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