Suzie Q by Vic Smeed

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Suzie Q by Vic Smeed

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6 October 2016 at 20:04 #68035
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Hello, I am a retired old codger with an inclination to have a go at a model boat. I apologise for the following series of questions but will need to eventually sort it all out.

About 40 years ago I bought some model boat plans and started to build Suzie Q as it seemed a straight forward model to build looking at the simplicity of the plan. I built the hull and then realised I had messed up by using 1/16th balsa sheet for the hull instead of either 1/8th balsa or 1/16th ply. As I was busy working at the time I gave up and put it to one side. Yes I was recently clearing out and came across the plans again which rekindled my interest. This time I have built the hull and used 1/16th ply. I have modified the cabin assembly so that it lifts out from the deck rather than have access to the inside from the rear floor and a cover on the top but I now wonder how to make it waterproof enough, or should I seal it in and use the restricted access hatches??.

My next thoughts are turning to not knowing what motor to use though I have a 500 whatever that means. Also I need to have a suitable rudder servo and a neighbour into model aircraft said it will need to be powerful as it will be like turning in concrete at speed. Other thoughts are related to the need for cooling ?, choice of batteries ? though I have quite a few NiMH 2900mAh in AA size.

As a beginner I am now realising that a simple looking plan isn't so simple when building gets under way. Other thoughts for the future will be how to finish it with paint, varnish, decorative items and suitable fittings.

Any help and guidance will be most appreciated.

Tony
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6 October 2016 at 20:04 #7080
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Semi scale off shore racer
7 October 2016 at 01:50 #68040
harry smith 1
Participant
@harrysmith1
Hi Tony

Welcome to the forum.

I use a 35mm brushless motor(1100kv) on a 3S(11.1volt) Lipo battery, a 60Amp car ESC(speed controller) with reverse and a 2 blade 40mm prop.

This is in a 34" Sea commander.

I have NO WATER COOLING on the motor and the ESC has an electric fan on top.

The motor runs only warm and the ESC is no problem.

I general get a good half hour plus from the battery.

Hope this helps you get started.

I have got the plans of the Swordsman, Sea Rover, Sea Hornet and Remora on PDF if you require.

Your local print shop would reprint them for you!!!

Regards

Harry
7 October 2016 at 07:57 #68044
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Hello Harry, Many thanks for your reply.

It sounds as though I should consider a brushless motor as its less of a problem if it gets wet. The batteries you use sound interesting if you are getting half an hour of use. Does it take very long to recharge ?? I did hear about Lipo batteries being a possible problem with water and apparently may explode. My neighbour has them for his aeroplanes but stores them in a metal case when not in use.

I note you have no problem with overheating using a 60Amp ESC so I may look into something similar.

Your offer of plans may give me some ideas of working with Suzie Q as its details and layout are not as complete as I would have hoped. I suppose that other more competent boat modellers would automatically fill in for anything not shown very well in the drawing.

I would appreciate seeing the plans you mentioned to further my learning curve in building my first model boat. In my drawing the lower half of the prop (not defined) is pointing below the bottom of the rudder and I can't tell if its OK or not drawn right. Don't want to criticise the designer but he would have been so experienced that such detail would have been obvious to him of what to do.

Many thanks for your help.

Tony
7 October 2016 at 08:51 #68045
Tony Hadley
Participant
@tonyhadley
RBC Kits sell a kit version of Suzie Q. In their advertising they lised the motor and battery which was used (probably in the prototype).

**LINK**

From youtube. Model looks stunning.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epBo6uu9avw

**LINK**

I have the original magazine item, but it would obviously out-of-date for your requirements and not worth posting.

Good luck with you build.

Edited By Tony Hadley on 07/10/2016 08:57:52
7 October 2016 at 09:18 #68046
harry smith 1
Participant
@harrysmith1
Hi Tony

The Lipo batteries are 5800mah 60C with battery alarm.

The charger must be good quality ,not a cheap one.

Your neighbour would help you on this matter.

A safety charge bag and do not leave unattended whilst charging.

Charge rate max is 5.8 amps on a 5800mah.

The motor I use is a Hobbyking 3639-1100kv which gives good speed, but if you wish to up the speed a 3648-1450kv.

Both these motors run on 3S and 4S Lipo batteries.

The ESC I use is a Hobbyking HK-60A SL(2-4S) with the program card.

The program card is very easy to use and I use the same setup for all my cars and boats.

The only change is the battery part for 3S and 4S.

See my Sea Hornet 2015 build on this site.

As for the Suzie Q, I would add stringers between the frames for strength and stops the plywood dipping between the frames.

Making the whole cabin a lift off one piece is a great idea.

It look like the servo would fit up against the transom and run the lead with an extension into the main cabin area.

Regards

Harry
7 October 2016 at 16:58 #68051
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Tony, Thank you for the message and links which were very interesting. I wonder if I would manage to control it at other than a slow speed !! I haven't had anything on water yet.

Harry, I appreciate your details and will go and have a look at Sea Hornet 2015. Ply dipping between the frames is something I would never have thought of. I have been lost with the many options for servo's and wonder how powerful it would need to be ?? Seeing what you have got, I will go to HobbyKing and have a look around their options.

Many thanks to you both for help and guidance.

Tony
8 October 2016 at 09:42 #68057
harry smith 1
Participant
@harrysmith1
Hi Tony

I use Hobbyking High Torque Analog w/proof 4.5KG( part no.HK15269 or part no.9225000013).

I like to have a bit of grunt in my servo's.

The price of the servo's on Hobbyking are cheap.

The trans I have is a Turnigy IA6, which handles up to 20 models with naming and you can setup each model to your requires.

I have two models with reverse rudder setup because of other type servo's which work opposite direction to the one above.

The dipping between the frames on the bottom of the boat make it stick to the water and at speed in rough water one side unsticks then the other side.

This makes the boat a nightmare to drive fast.

Harry
8 October 2016 at 16:07 #68060
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Thanks Harry, I will look into the items you mention, which could be quite an expensive minefield if its not right.

I never thought about the dipping between the frames and its effects. I have just skinned the hull with 1/16th ply and will now go and check for any dipping. Presumably If there is any I could possibly fill it out with filler or fibreglass etc or do I need to strip it and start again?? Not sure if I am competent enough to be able to drive it fast !! But I will hopefully give it a go when finished.

Again thanks for your help.

Tony
9 October 2016 at 12:19 #68083
harry smith 1
Participant
@harrysmith1
Hi Tony

For a filler I use car spray putty.

To get any dips sanded out, I use a 300mm long 75 x 50mm length of dressed hardwood to hold my sandpaper on.

This will show up the dips and is easy to sand.

I only fibreglass resin after with a foam paint brush.

A sand down and paint.

Harry
9 October 2016 at 15:33 #68086
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Hello Harry, I am very thankful of your offer to help.

I have checked with a straight edge and the only dips I can find are about a millimetre of concave on both sides of the rudder. All other areas of the hull are either flat (rear half from Transom) or have convex curves up to the bow of the model.

When you mention dips in the hull, would you think this is enough to disturb the boat at speed ?? If so I am sure I can get some spray putty. For the fibreglass finish I have some Eze Coat which I hope will be OK over the hull before sanding and painting.

I am now able to start looking for transmitter/receiver, ESC, servo, brushless motor and batteries for sizes which will physically fit and adequately power the model, but pleased you have given me some very useful ideas of what to look for.

Are there separate batteries for power to the motor and other items such as receiver, servo etc??? or does everything come from one battery ??

Many thanks for your time and help.

Tony
10 October 2016 at 04:27 #68088
harry smith 1
Participant
@harrysmith1
Hi Tony

The ESC has a lead for the battery, another 3 wires for the motor.

The 3 wires to the motor I connect the center one of each and the other two can connect up(if the motor turns the wrong way cross over the outer two.

Back the ESC, this has the on/off switch and the lead to the receiver which supplies power from the battery via the ESC to the receiver and the rudder servo.

So only one battery required in the boat.

The battery placement is very important in the boat, so allow a large area to move it forward or aft.

A good start point is the balance point of the boat is 1/3 the length of the boat from the stern.

In the Sea Hornet I had to add a bit of lead under the forward seat to trim the boat.

I use the Hobbyking Turnigy IA6 6 channel radio as it handles up to 20 models.

As we have only two model companies in southern Tasmania I order all my stuff From Hobbyking.

Harry
10 October 2016 at 09:09 #68090
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Thank you Harry, I am now in a position to start putting my list of control items together. I have a better idea of what to get, hopefully to build and complete my first acceptable model.

Is there a rule of thumb for where the water line should be or is it variable ??

I have been looking around and find the available lists of items being sold are almost endless, so it becomes a challenge to find the right bits to buy.

Tony
10 October 2016 at 10:13 #68091
harry smith 1
Participant
@harrysmith1
Hi Tony

The balance point of the boat is more important than the waterline, that is more for displacement hull boats.

A little nose down as this will pickup from about 1/3 throttle.

If you wish to make the boat lighter, a Zippy Compact 3S 3700mah 60C is 338 grams against a Zippy Compact 3S 5800mah 60C is 449grams.

The battery voltage alarm is part no. VOLTAGE- ALARM(THE BLACK ONE) also checks each cell voltage and total voltage.

Not the ESC requires connectors to the battery and the motor comes with connectors between the motor and ESC.

The 60A car ESC is 91grams.

The only motor I had to check the weight is a 3648-1450kv which is 183grams.

These are real weights not Hobbyking weights!!!!

Harry
10 October 2016 at 21:36 #68105
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Hello Harry, I am impressed with your photo's during construction of Sea Hornet. I haven't taken any pic's but have got the hull glued together and cut the decking sections from sheets of 1/16 obechi.

As the drawing was difficult to follow with the hull panel sections overlapping for the rear sections and then butt joint near the front I have actually butt jointed them all the way along the chine from transom to bow. Hope this is going to be OK.

What I noticed you had created was a section at the bow made up of balsa blocks. I could have done this if I had seen it earlier. But I know what to do next time.

Looking at your workmanship I feel I will need to improve my woodworking and painting skills, but I am not giving up now.

Tony
13 October 2016 at 21:52 #68164
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Harry, I have looked at the Turnigy IA6 radio from HobbyKing and noted that it refers to aeroplanes and helicopters.

Does it matter ?? How do you use yours for channels etc. I would have thought it should be able to work for all radio controlled models????

Susie Q is coming along slowly as I try to work out how to fit the servo and electric motor. I have seen how to make the coupling straight by wrapping it with card and cable ties for alignment between the motor mounting and prop shaft.

Do you have to do anything particular with the receiver aerials in terms of layout for best reception from the transmitter???

Best regards

Tony
14 October 2016 at 14:28 #68165
Diede van Abs
Participant
@diedevanabs87670
Hi Tony,

Lately, most radios (especially the cheaper ones from China, like the Turnigy ones) are focused on planes, helis and drones. That is mostly a matter of preconfigured mixes, and if (and which) stick is not self-centering. Most radios have possibilities to configure your own mixes and channel assignments (my Hobbyking PB-6A does – computer needed and my Turnigy 9x does – a lot of button banging) and the centering of channels is a matter of personal preference and can be tweaked if you open up the transmitter.

I can only assume that the IA6 has its own options of configuring the channels and mixes to your liking but I would be much surprised if it doesn't. Don't let it stand in your way.

The receiver aerial should be above water line, preferably as high up as possible, but doesn't have a need to stick up or out of the boat. My recommendation would be to stick it under your deck.

Also, this thread is worthless without pics! Please post some photos of your progress?

Edited By Diede van Abs on 14/10/2016 14:29:31
14 October 2016 at 16:07 #68167
Ray Wood 3
Participant
@raywood3
Hi Tony

If you want to keep life simple a 2 channel set will be fine for an electric boat, I would recommend the Carson Reflex RC 2CH Pro3 2.4ghz set it has a dry cell transmitter, with the left hand stick spring loaded for ahead & astern and the right stick is self centering for steering it comes with a servo for steering. Price £34.95

No computer set up's and they have servo reversing on the transmitter and work fine I have several.

Regards Ray
14 October 2016 at 19:16 #68168
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Thank you Diede Van Abs and Ray for your replies. I must apologise for my lack of pic's but will post some soon to show what I have got so far. I will go and get my camera now and be back soon.

There does seem to be a lot of choices for Tx/Rx, servo's etc but feel I am a little held up trying to decide where to go from here, so I will get some kit and if its wrong…….. I suppose errors are a part of the learning curve. I look forward to improving my modelling skills and radio technology with help from members of this forum. I did say earlier that all I have is an old plan I bought many years ago. Looking at the plan I thought it would be easy to build, but boy was I mistaken without the necessary experience !!!!! Ignorance is bliss !!!!

As a beginner I am open to all sorts of advice and so far I am getting lots of useful comments on this forum.

Bye for now

Tony
14 October 2016 at 21:32 #68171
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Any help and advice on progress from here would be most appreciated. Scroll down to see other pic's.

The Cabin assembly is created so that it lifts out of the deck to access the controls. I have started to apply Obeche at the bow and have made sections to fit down each side and across the rear. The cabin top will be covered with Obeche to match the deck.

Here are some pic's as requested by Diede van Abs. Hope they are OK. Not sure how to fit the link from the servo to the rudder for best control ?? The servo base and prop shaft are only loosely fitted just in case there are any better ideas. The motor mounting panel is glued in place and the screws are into threaded inserts to allow removal of the motor. No, they don't go through the hull !! It was configured for a Tornado 500 brushed motor but I have ordered a brushless motor and hope I can get it in OK.

Regards

Tony
15 October 2016 at 12:10 #68179
harry smith 1
Participant
@harrysmith1
Hi Tony

I like to stick control's of the IA6 and it's OK for boats, I have used these unit for 3 years with no problems.

The only thing when you change a setting to save it HOLD DOWN THE CANCEL BUTTON for about 10 seconds.

I have a number of models setup different on the transmitter with names for each and all work OK.

The price of a 2 channel in Tasmania with servo's is about the same price of the IA6 with 6 servo's!!!

Good work on the boat.

Your motor alignment!!!

I designed a simple disc with the engine mount bolted to the drive shaft.

I posted as motor alignment tool on the site, used it my Tipsea 2016 with a bit of heat shrink because it is a flex drive setup.

The Flex drive slipped into the motor straight up.
15 October 2016 at 13:14 #68181
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Can't find your motor alignment tool or Tipsea 2016 and wonder how to search for particular items on the site ??

Regards

Tony
16 October 2016 at 06:43 #68189
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Hello Harry, I found your alignment tool and can see how useful it is.

Strange but I have got similar 4 mm and 6 mm ends from some old 6 inch linear potentiometers which are of the same shape as your tool that I can use for the alignment task. Many thanks for the idea.

What is the reason for using a flex drive ???

Regards

Tony
16 October 2016 at 08:32 #68190
harry smith 1
Participant
@harrysmith1
Hi Tony

Flex drive, because I bought a set of three units and have only used one in a Atlas Line hydro.

The Tipsea 2016 is the Japanese wooden kit of the Northwind IC race boat, so I only plan to go forward with no reverse.

Harry
27 October 2016 at 10:58 #68344
Tony Cotton
Participant
@tonycotton48491
Suzie Q is coming on slowly but I now have a Turnigy TGY-i6 transmitter / receiver.

I built up the electrical system on the bench and it works. Left, right, forwards and reverse. I also made up a servo with a micro switch to put lights on and off from channel 6 which is a rotary control. How do I decide what propellor to use, as there are lots to choose from?? Is there a calculation for size, number of blades etc. to give a suitable operation ???

Don't think its going to be much of a racer but it is my first attempt.

Does the prop shaft tube need to be supported above and below the hull ???Not showing anything on the drawing I have.

What I am now thinking of is what to do regarding lubrication of the rudder, prop shaft and motor. I did see something fitted to a prop shaft which looked like a tube fitted at right angles to the prop shaft tube. Is this what I need ??? and how is it created??

Regards

Tony
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