Returning modeller

[Dave Cooper 6Participant @davecooper6]

Hi Jim

I used Rustins sanding sealer and 'standard' model aircraft (clear) dope from the model shop – both were past their 'sell-by' date but it didn't seem to matter.

I also used a little P38 in places without problems. As mine is a fast launch, I was trying to keep the weight down where possible. (Filler can get quite heavy if used in excess).

This is probably one of those areas where everyone has their own favourite methods….if in doubt, make up some test pieces and try out different combinations…

Cheers,

Dave

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Hi Dave,

Funnily enough I`ve set up a test piece this morning. I have a new tin of Ronseal wood filler in the garage I`m just seeing how the filler and Gorilla glue work together and try other combinations.

I can understand you wanting to keep the weight down on your launch. My boat in real life had a max speed of 25knots I believe, so for me speed isn`t a great requirement but, like everyone else, weight is a consideration not to be ignored.

Thanks for your reply,

Jim.

[Ray Wood 3Participant @raywood3]

Hi Jim,

I have been using Bartoline – Ready Mixed Lightweight Filler 500ml for £6.00 from Robert Dyas great stuff no mixing or smell to upset the management , works equally well on balsa or ply, obviously not a structural filler like P38 but it dries fast and sands easily and sealed with sanding sealer ready to paint or glass cloth, the equivalent stuff sells for model aeroplanes at three times the price.

Regards Ray

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Hi Ray,

We have a Robert Dyas in Fleet so next time I`m there I`ll have a look to see if they have any.

I`m a fair way off cleaning up the first planking layer so there`s plenty of time yet but thank you for the information.

I don`t really have a problem with anything that has a smell as I`m out in the garage. The only problem now is it`s getting a bit chilly in the evenings!

Regards,

Jim.

[Tim CooperParticipant @timcooper90034]

Jim

Try Wilkos they have the lightweight filler. I have used it around the house, gave me a reason for buying it and on models. Can't remember the price but not would not have been expensive.

Tim

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Hi Tim,

Thanks for that. We have a Wilkos not far away so will have a look .

Cheers ,

Jim.

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Got to the point on the first layer of planking where the hull changes from round bilge into a chine at the bow.

Having never done this before it`s been a question of how I can model the different angles required and I`ve settled on the method shown in the two pictures in the album. The small gap along the top is supposed to be vertical, the next level is also flat but angled down to meet the curve of the lower hull. At present I`m gluing in scrap pieces to give a gluing surface for the smaller pieces of planking. Luckily there is a rubbing strip that goes along the length of the boat at roughly the point where these joins take place so that will cover the joint.

Whether the way I`m doing this is good practice or not I don`t know, but hopefully it will look much better when the second planking takes place. I`ve been using Gorilla Glue as the adhesive and did a test piece to see if it would stick to the filler I`ve tried. ( Ronseal wood filler ) which it did.

Regards,

Jim.

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[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Just had a look at the diorama on Dave Coopers albums.

Very nice modelling Dave. As a railway modeller as well, I always like the mix between canals and railways. It can always produce some interesting combinations to model.

Regards,

Jim.

[Dave Cooper 6Participant @davecooper6]

Thanks Jim

I'm looking forward to getting the rope-worked incline working. I have a little truck and a weighbridge to add as well.

If my programming will stretch to it, I'll try to make the truck do random runs from the narrow boat up to the goods yard pausing at the weighbridge on the way. This will be under 'Arduino' control. There is also a master switch on the front panel for manual control – just in case !

Merry Christmas,

Dave

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

My thanks to everyone whose given me help and advice since I joined the forum in the summer.

Hoping we can all manage the best Christmas we can under the circumstances.

Take care, Merry Christmas and a good New Year,

Jim.

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Finally managed to get all the first layer of planking on the hull ( all108 each side )and have put some pictures on the album, warts and all!

I have to say, some of it went on very well and some of it was, frankly, horrible! At the moment it`s had a bit of a rub down to highlight all the pitfalls , and there are many, so it all looks pretty rough. The pencil lines are showing where the rubbing strips went so that should eventually hide the change in angle. The lines on the hull at the stern are to show where the prop shafts will come through. I do like the shape of the hull with it`s many changes of angles as you go from bow to stern and this is where my next problem is coming from.

My original plan was to double plank ( and that still might happen ) but where I am at present shows the hull to be sturdy, and apart from the thinning of places with the rubbing down, would almost be enough. There are quite a few peaks and troughs over the length that will need filling to smooth the shape out and I`m wondering if when doing that I could use filler on the whole hull. If I second plank I will change the angle to something more suited to the shape, especially near the stern where the curves are tight. At least there will be a good gluing surface to work with.

Jim.

[Ray Wood 3Participant @raywood3]

Hi Jim,

That hull is looking a good shape

I'd glass cloth it now then fill it with P38 ?

Regards Ray

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Hi Ray,

I know nothing about glass clothing other than things I`ve read on here so I would be a complete novice but certainly willing to give it a go.

Any suggestions on what type to use, and the adhesive? I know De Luxe do a glass cloth . Would that be suitable? You suggest glass now. Even with all the pitfalls there are? How many layers of cloth would go on or is that down to the individual?

Sorry to fire so many questions but this is something new to try.

Many thanks,

Jim.

[Ray Wood 3Participant @raywood3]

Hi Jim,

Everybody here has their own favourite methods, mainly with a 2 part epoxy resin and light grade glass cloth the type most used for skinning model aeroplane wings 25 g/m2

I have used this in the past with West System epoxy resin, quite expensive say £40, I now use a water based resin sold by Bucks-Composites £6.50 with longer working time & wash your brushes in water

You are not applying the cloth for strength your planking gives you that, but 4-5 coats is no problem, I also glass with the same grade glass cloth between the bulkheads inside the hull, If you have a look at the early stages of my MV Oldenburg build thread it shows how the cloth will follow the contours of the hull with no problem.

The P38 filler will stick to the glass cloth ok and gives a good base to work on

Regards Ray

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Hi Ray, thanks for that information, I`ll look it all up on line.

Always handy if you can find something that lets you wash your brushes in water!

I read somewhere that it was wise to resin the inside of a planked hull before the deck goes on so that fits in with what you`ve said. I`ll just rub the hull down until I can get it looking presentable and go from there.

Dumb question but I take it 4-5 coats is cloth and resin.? How many would you suggest on the inside?

As usual, many thanks for your help,

Regards,

Jim.

[Ray Wood 3Participant @raywood3]

Hi Jim,

Only one layer of glass cloth on the outside and inside, I was referring to 4- 5 coats of the resin to fill the weave.

I do paint inside the hull with enamel paint to seal the water based coating.

Regards Ray

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Thanks Ray,

Now I realise what`s involved before doing this I shall be looking at fitting the rubbing strips round the hull and anything else on the hull so will need to be ordering some wood strips to suit. Plenty to do before I get round to glass clothing. It might be a bit warmer by then as well. Not having a heated garage would delay any drying process a bit.

Thanks once again,

Jim.

[Ray Wood 3Participant @raywood3]

Hi Jim,

Yes I'm lucky with my garage being partially in the front of our house

I still put a fan heater on when I'm modelling.

The water based resin is not heat sensitive like epoxy which likes 15 deg and as there is no smell so you could work indoors ?

I would glass the hull before you add the rubbing strakes, spray rails etc the cloth won't go up and over them.

Regards Ray

Edited By Ray Wood 2 on 11/01/2021 11:26:07

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Hi Ray,

I`d been studying your pictures of your Cullamix build and noticed the rubbing strakes on the hull. You`ve answered that thought now so I`ll leave them till later. I`ve been on line and found the Bucks Composite site so I`ll get in touch shortly.

My house is a mid terrace with an integral garage so warmth wise is not desperately cold unless it`s a really cold one outside. No heater, just me! It gets a lot warmer though if things go wrong!!

One thing I did notice on the resin, quite a long time hardening. Once coated, I`d need to find somewhere for things to dry.

Regards,

Jim.

[Ray Wood 3Participant @raywood3]

Hi Jim,

Ah yes Cullamix is one of my favourites, I think I used West Systems epoxy on her hull as she is balsa planked, and decent larger weave glass cloth and polyester resin on the inside between the bulkheads.

She weighs 35lbs, the cast iron ballast is 25lbs of loco wheel castings that were spare

Shame she's only been near the water once last year to tow her new barge.

Our airing cupboard great for drying things as long as I don't get caught !!

Regards Ray

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Just been reading the blog by Graham Jewitt regarding glass clothing a hull.

A question I`d like to ask is, can you cloth in strips or does it have to be layered as one sheet? My concern would be trying get round a shape that has varying curves in it and trying to avoid wrinkles or bubbles. Does layering in one sheet include the transom or is that best done separately? Should a wrinkle occur can they be sanded out very easily?

I ask all this as it`s something I`m considering at some point in the future and am just building information prior to eventually , possibly, trying. At the moment I have no experience.

Regards,

Jim.

[Ray Wood 3Participant @raywood3]

Hi Jim,

If you use one piece for each side of the hull and work from the keel you brush the bubbles out as you go, or you can blow the hull over with spray mount glue and lay the cloth on to fix it lightly, the cloth is very capable of following the compound curves on the hull

I'd do the transom last with a separate piece.

Regards Ray

Edited By Ray Wood 2 on 15/01/2021 15:19:29

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Hi Ray,

Thanks for that. I`ve studied your album quite a lot and noticed the single sheet over the hulls but thought I`d just ask about doing it in strips.

I thought the transom would have to be a separate piece so that`s clarified that.

I`ve had a look on line at different ways shown of using glass cloth but a lot seem to show mostly making a hull from a mold.

As usual, thank you for your help.

Regards,

Jim.

[James Hill 5Participant @jameshill5]

Managed to put the holes through the hull today, (not very exciting I know ).

It looks like I`ll have to change the angle of the prop shafts slightly to be able to line up the motors accurately. The original angle left me with not being able to put something under the motors to hold them down, they were so close to the hull.

The only thing I might be able to do is find a different motor bracket, the ones I`m using are the quite heavy black plastic type.

Next job is to get some brass sheet to make the two rudders,settle on their position and then fit the shafts.

Regards,

Jim.

[ashley needhamParticipant @ashleyneedham69188]

James. I usually make my own motor hold downs.

What you can do, if the motors need to be as low as possible, is to wrap them in clingfilm and then push them into a wodge of filler. When dry, de-mount, unwrap and you will have two perfect cradles for the motors (I am assuming brushed?). Put a stud between the motors at the same time in the filler and then just use a flat bar across the motors and a wing nut or nyloc, job done.

it is nice to have a flatter angle on the propshaft…a bone of contention on the forum.

Ashley

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