TEV Wahine 1/35 Build

[Dave MilbournParticipant @davemilbourn48782]

Loads of people have asked my why I don't do this for a living and of course it would no longer be a hobby.

Never a wiser word spoken. Been there; done it, and got the Tee-shirt. I came perilously close to taking up gardening at one point!! I'm looking forward to this thread's progress. As Tim says, it's modelling extraordinaire.

Dave M

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

OMG
I cant even begin to think how you would even do this for a job, apart from film minatures.

most stuff is CG now and that IS my job….

We can but dream,,, at very least I would not get so overweight as I currently am being on my feet

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

I have at least had the benefit of time to try the aluminium plating out and exposing it to extreme temperatures of up to 40 degrees, and I think it will work.

[Rich DunnParticipant @richdunn71792]

Well I'll be buggered,I am back in after being locked out for months.

My Login was not being accepted and asking for new ones from admin got no answers.

To bring you all up to date, I suffered from a severe torn tendon connecting my bicep to my shoulder in both arms and it has totally stuffed me, could not even lift a glass of water for 18 months.

However it is almost over and getting ready to go again if nothing else gets in the way.

 

Edited By Rich Dunn on 01/09/2020 09:19:30

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

I got no messages Rich – who did you send them to?

Colin

[Rich DunnParticipant @richdunn71792]

Hi Colin, I honestly can't remember now, it would be 9 months now but when I applied to reset password it failed and said to email an admin address, it was that. I seem to remember is was a females name.

What I can tell you is that changing passwords I never get the emails, actually that is what the issue was it never came so I emailed a person, I have not got the confirmation from tonight either.

All good now

[Rich DunnParticipant @richdunn71792]

It would have been someone from the contact us page.

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

That probably explains it. There was no editor for quite a while this year when the magazine was suspended and the email was unattended. The company was also badly affected by the virus situation and there were staff reductions.

Not sure why things have suddenly started working again though. If it should happen again, create a new registration and post the problem on the Forum. At the moment I am the only person looking after it on an unpaid basis!

Colin

[Rich DunnParticipant @richdunn71792]

Wow that's sad, I would have expected to see an increase of modelling going on given the virus and having to stay home.

It does seem awefully quiet.

I am having to consider redoing hull in GRP as my arms can't handle the weight anymore and help would have been awesome as never done that before.
Only toying with the idea mind you.

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

There is certainly an increase in modelling going on but when virtually all the newsagent shops that sell magazines were shut for a considerable time, sales and revenue plummeted which caused a lot of problems as it has of course elsewhere.

Colin

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

I have a sad update regarding the hull of to this point.
The time I have bee away from this project has been worthwhile and taught a very valuable lesson, do not glass a boat interior and use a light tissue on the outside!.

I started to work on this again a few weeks ago and found when I uncovered the hull that the hull has fractures

not just one or 2 but 6 300mm long cracks in the hull and displaced wood like it had been knocked hard, but it has not so I have put this down to the unstable nature of the glass I have done.

I have not given up though and expect to be back on track in a few weeks. after I rebuild the hull up to the knuckle line using a more solid and durable technique, Bread and Butter.

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

I have been experimenting with a way of making this hull in this way but due to the prices of wide boards and stability I have come up with a way of making the layers out of multiple parts and ensuring accurate assembly of the layers. it involves drafting the bread and butter layers in 3d cad firt to establish the outer and inner cut lines in the typical way but the staggering joins in each layer so that each layer is made from either 3 or 4 parts, the whole is guided by cad cut bulkheads that sit inside the hull and support the plank end and midpoint at the points in the hull where the joins fall, of course this way of working requires extreme accuracy in cutting the laminations in particular the inside cuts abut that is not a problem as I have a VERY good bandsaw that I have setup to optimum performance.

The smaller tug model has already been glued up now.

I had all the templates printed onto heavy drafting film last June an included in those were reference lengths for measuring any movement in the prints once ready to cut and I have to report that here in Humid Hot Australia, after this time It has not moved even half a mm in all that time. so it worked well indeed, so all planks have been cu out and are currently being glued to boards and cut out as I write this.

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

I was able to buy enough wood for the hull for this from local Hardware (Bunnings) after sorting through the stock for straight boards, ranging from 190 mm up to 240mm wide in 1800mm and 2400mm lengths, this has been stacked and stored inside the house for a further 6 months as well.

Ended up costing just over $200 dollars so not too bad, the rest of the work I have done on the hardware,running gear and Superstructure will be reusable.

The final plots

Note the red lines which represent the line of the inside plank on the next layer, this helps a lot with accuracy athwartships, the steeped bulkhead patterns can also be seen in bottom right corner.

Edited By Richard H Dunn on 23/05/2021 02:07:34

Edited By Richard H Dunn on 23/05/2021 02:15:16

Edited By Richard H Dunn on 23/05/2021 02:27:10

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

Posted by Richard H Dunn on 23/05/2021 01:52:48:

I have a sad update regarding the hull of to this point.
The time I have bee away from this project has been worthwhile and taught a very valuable lesson, do not glass a boat interior and use a light tissue on the outside!.

I started to work on this again a few weeks ago and found when I uncovered the hull that the hull has fractures

not just one or 2 but 6 300mm long cracks in the hull and displaced wood like it had been knocked hard, but it has not so I have put this down to the unstable nature of the glass I have done.

I have not given up though and expect to be back on track in a few weeks. after I rebuild the hull up to the knuckle line using a more solid and durable technique, Bread and Butter.

Do you think this may be due to the wood warping rather than the glass arrangement? When I think back to my college lectures on seasoning wood I am amazed nowadays at how quickly wood is turned from trees into planed timber in the hardware shop. Obviously driven by cost savings and profit, not surprisingly there is still a degree of drying to occur and this can invariably happen after it has been used on a project.

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

I think Richard has a point in that the problem is with the wood. The GRP coverings are essentially inert and may have resisted the expansion and contraction of the timber, making things worse. Dissimilar materials moving at different rates.

As well as incomplete seasoning, external conditions can cause problems such as major changes in temperature and humidity and you seem to have had more than your fair share of that in Australia over the last year or so.

I once collected a large model from a friend elsewhere in the UK to take it for exhibition as he couldn't manage the trip himself. I put it in my dry and not too cold garage prior to the exhibition whereupon the wood superstructure started to curl up like a banana. Being elderly, my friend had contructed the model in a warm centrally heated house in a very dry atmosphere and the humidity in my garage caused the wood to take up moisture and expand. I quickly brought it indoors and fortunately the exhibition was also quite well heated so the model returned to normal and won him a medal!

Colin

[Chris FellowsParticipant @chrisfellows72943]

My models will definitive have to remain in the house!

Chris

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

My friend's house was VERY hot!

I think it is sudden environmental changes that cause the most damage. Very often gradual ones can be accommodated.

Think plasticard decks in hot sunshine! The material expands and it has to go somewhere.

Colin

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

It could well be the heat but I can assure its not "wet timber" unseasoned that is.
i will explain why, my background for the first 28 years of my life was building high end furniture and fitting out super yachts in Australia and my home country of New Zealand, I also spent many years and still do build hand made acoustic and jazz guitar and that requires TOTAL control of the wood, I assembled some 15 years ago and still have not varnished them and they don't have so much as a crack in them .

I have dehumidifiers in workshop which is also air conditioned, but not on all the time I must add.

The likely cause was the heat and uneven nature of the grp, the planking was well seasoned and western cedar is very stable as far as wood goes.

I also check the moisture content of wood before using it hence why I also stacked the timber for this hull for a further 6 months to acclimatize to this house.

The tissue used on the outer hull was not strong enough to resist even the hulls own weight so it has started to collapse around her keel, much the same way as HMS Victory is and the way Cutty Sark was as well and I worked on that project so have seen it first hand.

so really a combination of insufficient strength and failure to follow the golden rule of do to the back side as you do to the front, I assumed the glass on both sides was enough but nope one was heavy matting and one was tissue on a 5mm core…. not enough.

Edited By Richard H Dunn on 23/05/2021 22:04:05

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

Re styrene, yeah not an option here, I gave 20 AO sheets away a few months ago for that reason it just melts.
Its better to spend the money on .5mm-3mm birch plywood, expensive but at least safe.

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

Just thought i would add this selection of items I have done over the years as it shows my background and knowledge of working with timber, and it might interest someone.

If these are not appropriate due to not being model boats i will remove.

 

Edited By Richard H Dunn on 24/05/2021 03:52:21

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

This one used some steaming and planking technique for the Niche, also lute making skills.

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

At the end of the day it was simply a conversational suggestion, not a criticism.

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

Sorry if I came off as defensive, I was merely trying to illustrate I know about wood stability and that I am not going into this unprepared.
Sorry again.

[Richard H DunnParticipant @richardhdunn]

I want to thank everyone who has helped me along the way with this build even though I now have to start the lower hull again and rethink a few things I could not have got so far without the support and positive remarks and encouragement, I am someone who needs that sort of feedback, I am feeling right now that I seem to be offending more people than I am entertaining which is not my intent, I am a bit socially awkward and sometimes don't realize the actions I take or things I say can me taken the wrong way or seen as something else, one of the quirks in my personality I am afraid.

It's fine with friends and people you know but online you just come off as a plonker.
Aside from that the stop start nature of this project has been unavoidable due to the fact I am only 49 now and still work long hours and unable to give time to this sometimes for long periods of time, that last few years have been plagued by injuries but I am finally ready to spend 1-2 hours on it every night…more or less and make some headway.
I feel at this point though that perhaps the best thing to do is to wind up the online build because I honestly don't think I am helping anyone and as I said above I feel as though I am inadvertently offending people.

It is a big job to keep updating these blogs and I am not sure I am capable of reading people well enough to avoid the negative reactions I might cause.
I regret this deeply and I am sorry if I have offended anyone at all.
I must also say sorry to anyone who was watching this intently , there seemed to be a few and I feel I have let you all down in that regard, unavoidable but still.., I know I get annoyed when blogs seem to stop without completion.
I am not giving up on the model I have spent far too much on it now to just stop and I have not lost interest at all, far from it.
Anyway now I am prattling on but i still get a lot of inspiration from watching others large scale work and use it too recharge me when the funks hit and it all seems too hard.

[Ray Wood 3Participant @raywood3]

Hi Richard,

I've been watching from the beginning of your build and have enjoyed it , Don't throw the towel in with the blog ! just keep it light so it doesn't become a chore, many people watch but don't comment. Is the original hull unrepairable ? seems rather drastic build it all again ?

Some of your climatic issues affecting the timber is not letting it breath which i believe paint does but epoxy resin doesn't ? There seems a pre-occupation of late of model boat builders to glass cloth everything, but I don't think it's required on timber boats except for maybe lite ply and balsa for structural reasons.

We have all sorts of ability levels on this forum, but I'm sure it's only a bit of fun at the end of the day

I bet your splendid furniture wasn't glass clothed !!

Good luck anyway

Regards Ray

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