On board camera

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

Hi all,

I have been thinking for some time about getting a mini video camera to take on board video from my boats. I know many people do this as a quick search on You Tube will reveal, but I wondered if anybody had a recommendation for a good piece of kit- not too cheap (I have seen keyfob cameras for a few pounds) but not horrendously expensive either.

I'd like it to be easy to operate and retrieve video files from. Has anybody used something they thought was good? I have Googled it but am looking for a personal recommendation.

All the best,

Ian

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

[BanjomanParticipant @banjoman]

Hello Ian,

I bought such a mini video camera last year, to see whether or not I found POV model boat filming sufficiently worthwile to invest at some later stage in the real McCoy – to test the waters, as it were.

I thus wanted something that would not cost and arm and leg, as many of the more well-known brads and models indeed do.

What I got was one called a Veho VCC-003-MUVI – it currently sells at Amazon (**LINK**) for around £30, whereas I paid just under £40 from the same seller last August.

Veho has a fairly extensive range of POV video cameras, most of them higher spec and more expensive: **LINK**. I have no idea how their higher end models compare with the household name brands such as GoPro et al., but I did find the basic model one that I got sufficiently good to be worth the money, if not much more than that.

For an idea of how the results look, here is a POV video shot with my Veho (if the embed does not work, here is a direct link to it on Vimeo: https://vimeo.com/136424078).

On board the Eilean Mòr, sailing on the Nekkerpoel from Banjoman on Vimeo.

/Mattias

[Bob Abell 2Participant @bobabell2]

Nice clear video, Banjo

Would the camera have fitted inside the cabin?………To get a Captain`s eye view, through the window?

Bob

[BanjomanParticipant @banjoman]

0Thanks, Bob!

And yes – this camera is small enough that it would have been perfectly possible to set it up inside the wheelhouse.

/Mattias

[BanjomanParticipant @banjoman]

Hello again Ian,

I forgot to mention, in answer to your questions, that the one I've got is quite easy to use, as it has only rather basic functions, and thus no menus or settings to navigate; it is also very easy to transfer the results to the computer afterwards via a simple USB connection.

However, among the many features that it does not have, there are a couple, the lack of which might make it worthwile to also look at some of the higher-spec (and, alas!, higher price) cameras out there.

Firstly, it would have been very useful to be able to turn it on and off by remote: as it is now, one has to turn it on and off with a button on the actual camera, which means that the first and last seconds of each sequence will be wobbly, and also that it has to be turned on and off somewhere where you can reach it.

Secondly, I would also very much have liked to be able to use it for still shots; again, this is of course something that requires a remote control function (and, ideally, a remote viewfinder, either a dedicated one or as an app).

Thirdly, the option to choose between a couple of different levels of resolution (not necessarily including HD) would have been nice.

In the final analysis, as I think already said, I found this one value for money, if only just, and having tried that sort of filming, I now know that sooner or later I will get a better one; in the meanwhile, I'll use the one I've got, while the money I've spent on it has helped me better understand what these things do and what to look for when I'm ready to spend a more serious amount of money on one.

/Mattias

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

Hello Mattias,

Thank you for your very compehensive and helpful reply. It occurs to me that I may have seen your on board video before and forgotten it- it looks very good I must say. I had a quick look at your links, but thought I'd respond quickly as you took so much trouble over your reply. I only saw your reply late last night as we were out playing- not banjo I hasten to add, but resonator guitar!

I think I will explore some of the more expensive options as it would be nice to have HD these days. I looked through a few of the seven hundred or so reviews of the camera you bought and it says something that so many have been sold and it is very useful that you have had actual experience of the camera and can report on it.

When I have had a better look through the Muvi site I will report back about the decision I made.Thanks also for the rider where you describe the actual use of the camera- you pay as much attention to detail in your posts as you do to your models! As I say, I will report back in due course.

All the best,

Ian

[Bob Abell 2Participant @bobabell2]

Hello Ian and Banjo

If you would like to see some quality on board video's……..

Take a look at The Buxton Club vids on YouTube

A few of the models were mine. They were sold to an Etherow Club member, who defected to the Buxton Club, some years ago

The boat to boat vids are very professional

I'll try and find them and post a link

Bob

[Bob Abell 2Participant @bobabell2]

Here they are….

Sorry chaps…….Windows 10 is on strike!

Go to YouTube and type…….Buxton Model Boat Club

Bob

Look for……"Buxton Model Boat club 7"

(This was my Britannia btw)

 

 

Edited By Bob Abell on 17/05/2016 09:16:26

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

Thanks Bob,

Just had a quick look and yes, fascinating. I did like the shots of Britannia (?) and the menacing submarine. I also looked at the one with Diana, an old Tarpon, which has always been a favourite and one I will build if I happen to live to be 400 years old!

I think the videos were shot in SD and it would be nice to have HD now. It would be quite useful to know how these videos were achieved.

The main thing I got from these videos is what a very nice place those chaps at Buxton have to sail at. It's always interesting to see other clubs sailing waters. It prompts me to think- if one could move anywhere in the country just for model boating purposes, where would it be?

Keep up the good work on Silver Mist by the way- you certainly set yourself a challenge with those 4mm planks!

All the best,

Ian

[BanjomanParticipant @banjoman]

You are very welcome, Ian — and warmest thanks for your kind words!

Yes, I had indeed already posted that video here on the forum, when it was first made last year.

Some very nice videos on the Buxton YouTube channel, Bob! using another vessel as camera platform can create some very attractive images, as it gets the camera close to both the water and the subject.

/Mattias

[Dodgy Geezer 1Participant @dodgygeezer1]

My experience of this market is:

The Veho is nice – the Go-Pro is better (and more expensive!) Google 'action cameras' to see what is available.

The market has a lot of cheap Chinese clones – rip-offs from the factories which make the original. The clones can be very cheap – £6 is the current clone Veho price on ebay – but they will have lower quality components and no quality checking…

If you just want to try things out, you can get key-fob cameras for £3 on ebay. Don't expect high quality output from these!

The effectiveness of the camera is critically dependent on the speed the frames can be written to the SD card. You get dropouts when the card isn't fast enough. So a good camera really NEEDS a good fast SD card. Save money on the card and you will have an expensive camera providing cheap results…

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

Thanks for that useful information. I'm aware that the Go-Pro is pretty expensive and that there are some extremely cheap options which instinct tells me to avoid. The gen about SD cards is handy to know. At the moment I'm inclined towards trying a Veho as Mattias has recommended.

Ian

[Dodgy Geezer 1Participant @dodgygeezer1]

You can actually do fairly well with cheap chinese, but only if you go into the transaction well armed with knowledge of what the market place is like, and what sort of thing is being sold there.

I have both a cheap Veho clone and a cheap key-fob cam that I'm quite happy with. But it involved a lot of research before buying. Luckily, there are people who do this as a hobby – here is an example research site for the cheap key-fob camera. You can see the sort of detail you need to go into…

**LINK**

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

Thanks for that- had a quick look at your link before responding.

One of the problems with modern life is that one seems to spend more and more time researching and learning how to use different bits of technology- and then it all changes again. Last night I was scrounging around looking at all this stuff and suddenly decided to go for the Veho camera that Mattias mentioned- it seemed relatively cheap on Amazon. So, I await it's arrival and will maybe report on how I get on later. At least I have seen what that one can do and the reviews seemed generally positive, the main criticism being that it's a bit flimsy, but I shan't be mounting it on a cycle helmet or bungee jumping with it!

I found the videos that Bob linked to very inspiring- it'll be nice to get some shots of other boats from water level.

Thanks to both of you gents who have given me input over this- I'll be interested to see how it goes.

All the best,

Ian

[Dodgy Geezer 1Participant @dodgygeezer1]

Posted by Ian Gardner on 19/05/2016 13:21:28:

….

One of the problems with modern life is that one seems to spend more and more time researching and learning how to use different bits of technology- and then it all changes again. ………

That is a general problem with modern life. What happens is that most people withdraw from the requirement to know what they are doing, and instead simply rely on what they are told to do by authority figures and 'experts'. The net result is that some appalling decisions in many areas of our lives go unchallenged.

I know that no one believes what politicians, estate agents and double glazing salesmen say any more, but in many cases the rot has spread to research scientists, doctors and engineers. No one should be considered right just because they have a position of authority*.

* – except me….

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

Luckily, in this case, I'm just spending few quid on a miniature video camera so it's unlikely to be a life changing decision!

Ian

[Philip MitchellParticipant @philipmitchell70963]

One place to look is Halfords or similiar where you will find a choice of 'Dash Cams' which are quite small, use a 12volt supply and easy to operate. Different prices get you different qualities of video.

Phil

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

Thanks Philip,

I have now bought a Veho Muvi camera which arrived yesterday. Initial impressions are good. It works- it's easy to use and the video looks pretty good- not HD but still clear- much better than my very first camcorder which cost over £700- admittedly a good number of years ago now. It seems very robust too, a good solid item.

I'm hoping for some decent weather tomorrow (probably in vain) so that I can give it a try out on a boat.

Ian

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

Well, I tried my Veho Muvi camera for the first time today. The results were disappointing (certainly not worth posting) as the picture kept going black, and I assume this might be an issue with the quality of the SD card that DG was talking about. It was the 4GB card that was supplied with the camera. Ten minutes of video time took up about a third of the card.

It will be worth persisting with as I can see it will be fun to put together some videos of this nature- so I'll buy a better card and see if that makes a difference.

The other issue I found was that the recording light is difficult to see so I'm never sure whether I'm recording. A clubmate sitting next to me said he could see it and if you look from one side down the hole it is visible. So maybe that's a quality control issue.

Both Mattias and DG were dead right it seems- it's worth having for experimentation but, like Mattias, I might go for someting more expensive if I decide to persue it. The GoPro Session looks quite promising, but at £150+ it would need more consideration.

I'll report back when I have a new SD card.

Ian

[BanjomanParticipant @banjoman]

Ian,

I had a look through my old e-mails, and found the order confirmation from when I bough the Veho Muvi, and yes: I forgot to say before that I did buy a better SD-card at the same time, more specifically a Verbatim 44012 (GB Class 10 Microi SHDH Card (**LINK**).

I'm not entirely certain, but I seem to recall having seen a comment on some forum or other when I googled Veho Muvi's before purchase to the effect that a better class SD card was needed, and so I ordered one, which is what I used to film the sequence I've linked to above.

Sorry for not having remembered to mention this before, but then again, such a card should luckily be neither difficult to find nor very expensive to buy …

/Mattias

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

No problem Mattias, it's very helpful to have your confirmation of my thinking, which of course, arose from DG's helpful ideas too. As soon as I got home and put the file in the computer and watched it I suspected as much but without input from you two I might have given up in disgust. I didn't even know that SD cards came in variable qualities- so I'll get another one and look forward to having another go. One person who might be disappointed is my clubmate whose beautiful steamboat I was following round the lake! Always another time.

More anon…

Ian

[BanjomanParticipant @banjoman]

Thanks, Ian – glad to hear that!

I was not aware either, before buying mine, that thereb were different classes of SD card, and had what's more (and worse) more or less forgotten until my memory was jogged just now.

In any case, for a quick overview, there's a list of SD card classes on Wikipedia: **LINK**

/Mattias

[Ian GardnerParticipant @iangardner62867]

Hello Mattias,

I had a scan of the Wikipedia page about SD cards last night and now feel more informed. I will need to go through it a bit more thoroughly but certainly all is clearer.

On viewing my rather poor first attempts yesterday, my wife could see the possibilities and encouraged me to persevere (not that I needed it) so that was a good sign! We do sail at a rather idyllc lake and it would be nice to record a miniature trip round it at this lovely time of year. Off to an actual shop to buy a card later then I can double check size and classification.

Ian

Edited By Ian Gardner on 26/05/2016 10:45:55

[Dodgy Geezer 1Participant @dodgygeezer1]

I use H2testw on the cards I buy – here is a link: **LINK**

I see that the cheapest MD-80 (that's the technology the Veho Muvi uses) cameras on ebay are down to £3.59. **LINK** At that price it may be worth getting one as a throwaway trial – the card you use will cost more than that! 808 cameras (the keychain ones) are even cheaper, and may well become free giveaways!

There are many variants of the 808s and MD80s out there – indistinguishable from the outside, and sellers may well claim to be selling one variant while actually shipping another. Most UK based sellers probably will neither know nor care about the different variants anyway.

I'd recommend people who are interested to buy one as a trial, at a cheap price, and treat it as disposable. Buy in a sufficiently reputable way to be able to get your money back if the item isn't delivered or is delivered dead, but don't be too worried if it fails after a week's use. In most cases it will work ok for a long time. When you have experimented and seen what is possible, you may want to buy a better piece of kit, and you will be doing so with some background knowledge at that point.

Here are a couple of links from a biker giving a flavour of his experiences with the 808, the Veho and an MD-80 Veho clone. **LINK**

**LINK**

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