Liverpool class lifeboat and tractor/carriage build

[Andrew WatersParticipant @andrewwaters50002]

A very interesting read Neil, nice work. Subscribed

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

cheers Andy……….

had quite a bit of help from Mike Pendlebury, mick french and others with plans, photos sketches and such…….

just a pity in the end that all the nice timbers used will be covered in paimt……….sacriledge really, but hey ho!.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

time marches on, and so does my efforts to build the carriage for the tractor and Liverpool class lifeboat.

today was in to making the side brackets that hold the roller and keel guids to the outrigger that will eventually be part of the tilt mechanism for launching and hauling the boat via the tractor's stern capstain.

the brackets were all made from 2mm 3 ply, and i used odourless cyano glue.

the inner plates of the brackets were drilled and then cut out and sanded to shape, with a sheathing all round the perimeters of the same 2mm x 8mm wide ply.

they have now been left to set and harden before the joints being sanded smooth.

that will be tomorrow before gluing up with outriggers being attatched to the keel guides.

there are six brackets each side of the keel guids according to plans, although once constructed, there might be a central 7th frame each side which is not shown, but could be there, but take it as an ommission to show the trailer axle detailing.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

this afternoon and evening i have spent time gluing in the brackets, but sadly it was two steps forward and one back, as the end plates of the brackets which i had glued yesterday with cyano were just not strong enough when claped up and kept departing company fron the main bracket………….not one or two ……..BUT EVERY SINGLE ONE"….

And so they were all cleaned up of the cyano and then glued in place with 30 minute setting stuff, and finally glued back in place on to the out riggers.

finally they were set hard and fast and i glued each outrigger via the brackets to the centre U shaped roller base.

and forgot to say that i drilled the holes in to the U section for the pins that suport the rollers. The rollers are going to be made from plastic, and will need no maintenance once set in place after painting.

the second frame is gluing now and shall be left for a couple of hours to set before the spring clamps are released, and the final piece of "flat iron" is glued onto the top of the U frame overlapping the bracket, giving some more glueing area to stop the frames/brackets from coming adrift under pressure.

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

I sometimes find Neil that cyano soaks into wood so quickly that there is nothing left at the surface to create the bond by the time you put it together. It is worth considering either painting a coat of gloss varnish on the glued area to seal the surface first or simply revert to good old white PVA glue.

I like the way you have deconstructed the framework then designed how you are going to manufacture and then build the various components of the frame. Superb scratchbuilding.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

thanks Richard, i know what you mean about cyano after this attempt………it was absolutely useless for the job and in the end i discarded it and rubbed down all parts ready for a second attempt…….

the carriage main framework is just about there after a few failed attempts..

i found that the first sets of frames to seperate the outriggers from the centre U trough on which the boats keel slots in to were very delicate and so have beefed them up,using the epoxy glue for joining the two and then, strength wise with extra timber top and bottom,glued in place and clamped, using alliphatic resin, but for all the mucking about and extra glues and timber reinforcements, it actually looks ok.

once all glues have set, later tonight [will give it about 4-5 hours to do so], i shall give it a good sanding to smooth all joints down and add the tracks to see how they look.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

I know it is missing the front steering wheels and axle and all things associated with that section……………..

but the main carriage has turned out better than i had expected and hoped for………….

no twists to it, it feels solid now that the strengtheners have been successful in tightening it up.

there is a slight adjustment i have to make to stop the inward camber of the bogeys to get the tracks to meet the ground squarely, but i am satisfied with the way it has gone so far.

and the next step is to make the front axle and set up, and i have decided to keep to the wooden theme for the basics for this, and will start that later on, possible tonight.

more probably tomorrow after visiting the garage to see how much a new clutch is for my old momo, as fried it today coming back from seeing the lads and families in New Brighton……..ohhh **** bother

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

That's where you were going wrong Neil, Nutella is only useful as a filler, it isn't strong enough to act as a glue!!

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

I was fascinated a short while ago when i found out who and where and why and how long ago Nutella was "invented".

do you or anuone else know before i share the info………..i found it amazing.

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

I'm sure I did once hear but I can't for the life of me remember what the story was.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

it was invented by an American nutritional scientise, especially for the hi altitude B17 Flying Fortress crews for their daylight bombing raids on germany during the 2nd World War…….

aparently the combination of the chocolate infused spread, mixed with crushed hazelnuts gave them the extra nutrition in rye bread sandwiches to keep them warm and alert and more to the point awake……..and was a substitute for coffee and caffine.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

well, this little part was a long process……it wasn't making the parts, but the gluing process of timber to timber………..so many small parts to be glued that the whole process took two days to produce….as i was having to glue with aliphatic resin, clamp for at least 4 hours each part at a time and leave until the next

i talk about the cantilever section between the main frame of the carriage and the forward fixing section which the two front steering wheels are fit. this has a locating pin and a locking pin to keep it in place.

when the locking pin is withdrawn, the trailer and front wheels bend in the middle like a one string fiddle.

so here it is in photos.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

the next part, the steering bogey and wheels took a somewhat quicker time……..just this afternoon.
I cut the sub frame of the bogey from Cherry wood and made some staples from mild steel wire.
i sat the axle for the bogey wheels in a piece of plastruct half round plastic moulding and set in place with blobs of cyano, before filling the half round containing axle with 2 part epoxy.
and before the epoxy set, i sat the axle and half round on the bogey, and set the staples into the pre drilled holes and left to set.
finally as mentioned earlier in the carriage build, the rear bogey tracks were not seating true and flat on the table surface, and so i put some fillets of Obeche timber to the side of the bogey rails, and once set cut those on the band say so that the bogeys fitted to the side of the carriage frame vertically…….
job done.

[Chris FellowsParticipant @chrisfellows72943]

Hi Neil

All looking good and will look the biz with the lifeboat on it.

Have you tried running the tractor yet or do you still have to fit the radio gear etc?

Chris

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

Posted by Chris Fellows on 11/05/2021 22:10:53:

Hi Neil

All looking good and will look the biz with the lifeboat on it.

Have you tried running the tractor yet or do you still have to fit the radio gear etc?

Chris

i hate electronics Chris, so that is the last thing on my mind at the moment……..but once everything is done [not the lifeboat as that is a project beyond at the moment] i'll wire it all up and have a play with it.

the trailer will look better when i finally get round to painting it with a cellulose sealer, and then a galvanised steel colour………i hope lol.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

here i was, thinking i had finished.

i had made the final piece in the puzzle..the triangular draw bar to attach the carriage to the tractor and attached it all……

so i decided to just see what it looked like with a boat sat on it….and so i decided to use Mick French's Mersey……………

Frenchie………i have a bone to pick with you!!!!

i put your mersey on to the carriage, and…………….

well all i can say is,there was a resounding CRAAACCKKK, AND i'm bloody glad i hadn't wasted my time and built a SLARS………because the whole bloody carriage collapsed under the weight of the boat……………

what an utter complete waste of bloody time……….So don't know whether to laugh or cry………at least i have a pattern should i want to rebuild it in 3mm plasticard at a later date………..but for now, i shall have a beer, a bar of Lindor chocolate and put it down to experience, lol

not to add insult to injury, i'd been out to Halfords this afternoon to buy some galvanised steel colour paint to paint the sodding thing with…………..bahhhh humbug!!!.

and so today, i scraped all of the glue off, reglued the wing on and left for a couple of hours……..

i will then drill and pin both sides with framing pins of about 0.5mm diameter……….and depending on how strong it seems…………..i'll try it out with some brass strip bracing to the thing………..if not, i'll switch to the main frame in timber and bond plastic to the insides of the framing and use 3mm plasticard to make the brackets.and glue with plumbers pipe weld.

[Chris FellowsParticipant @chrisfellows72943]

I think it will be Frenchie having a bone to pick with you!!!

Chris

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

Posted by Chris Fellows on 13/05/2021 20:48:56:

I think it will be Frenchie having a bone to pick with you!!!

Chris

you might be right, he's already told me i had better not have scratched his paintwork lol.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

so, unlike what i told Dave Stavros Jones last night when i was a little fed up with the thing that i was going to leave it all until the back end in autumn, i just couldn't leave it all in a state of flux………..

i did that once, when i was building my daughters Calmac Ferry and it took me 4.5 years to finish……….

so i got on with it this afternoon, and glued, drilled and pinned it all, and it feels sturdy enough……….sturdy enough to put the boat on it that it is built for………..my Liverpool class boat……….

and it has not buckled and bent and broken this time………thankfully.

[ashley needhamParticipant @ashleyneedham69188]

Ah, the issues of building a lookalike in wood instead of metal!

I feel for you, but at the end of the day the trailer does have to carry the weight, even statically.

AND then it has to be sturdy enough so you can drive it around….

Plumbers weld…good for sticking plastic to wood?

Ashley

[Richard SimpsonParticipant @richardsimpson88330]

The trouble is with leaving things for a while is that you forget what you have done so far.

A perfect example was recently I was converting an OO gauge locomotive and bought a spare body for the purpose. I was half way through the job before I realised that the original body was actually closer to the end result so it was far easier to use that one. Then I went into hospital for five weeks. When I came out and restarted the project I had completely forgotten that I had decided to go with the original body and went back to the spare one. I got myself into a complete mess trying to fit bits and pieces that were built for the wrong body!

I got there in the end but made my life extremely difficult for myself.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

it took me 4.5 years to build this one for my daughter……there were many problems with making things accessible for R/C and so i would get frustrated and leave the thing for months.

in the end i realised it wasn't the model, but myself suffering depression due to personal reasons, and sat there one morning just after christmas and told myself that nothing was insurmountable if i got off my bum and cracked on…………and by the end of may of that year, after taking 4 years up to that moment, i had finished it….all 60 inches of her.

[ashley needhamParticipant @ashleyneedham69188]

That’s very nice Neil and worth the build time.

I am a bit like that, and I have a large model half done on the shelf. I find the longer these things take the more your mojo for getting them finished evaporates.

My HMS Manchester hung in the shed roof for probably 20 years and at one point I almost binned it (drive gear, steering deck and superstructure done only, no detail) but in a fit of enthusiasm I purchased a few fittings and finished her..a basic finish but finished nonetheless!

With lockdown, I have found that some recent builds have taken mere weeks (!) not only due to being relatively simple, but I find myself working on them day and evening virtually 7 days a week.

Ashley

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

so true Ashley…..its no good laboriously slogging on if your heart and soul isn't in it at the time.

[neil hpParticipant @neilhp]

All timber on the trailor carriage, was tonight given 3 coatings of cellulose sanding sealer to close the grain ready for spraying with an undercoat and then a top coat.

Tomorrow will be paint time

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