Complaint about supplier

[David Marks 2Participant @davidmarks2]

David,

I'm sorry but I'm afraid that this forum is not the appropriate place to air complaints about a particular supplier. Whilst I have no doubt of your sincerity we are not in a position to implicitly take sides in a dispute to which we are not a party as I am sure you will understand. I do hope that you manage to resolve the situation with the supplier.

Colin

 

Edited By Colin Bishop, Website Editor on 22/07/2015 18:13:33

[David Marks 2Participant @davidmarks2]

[Paul TParticipant @pault84577]

Hello Colin

It is probably far to late for me to ask as I am possibly the worst culprit for committing fopa's but is there a set of rules that govern our activities on this forum?

Paul

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

Yes, Me!

Colin

[Paul TParticipant @pault84577]

Ah

There is only one rule then

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

Yup! It's called common sense. This has always been a civilised forum so the less rules the better as rules frequently lead to arguments and it is impossible to cover all eventualities.

So If I feel a post is not appropriate I may remove or edit it and explain why. Seems to have worked reasonably well so far.

Colin

[David Marks 2Participant @davidmarks2]

Colin

Why has my complaint against a specific supplier been banned but within the last week or so a forum member made adverse comments about a well known parcel delivery company which you allowed? From where I am sitting the forum is operating double standards. All I have done is record the truth.

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

David,

It is a different situation in my view. Complaining about national delivery companies is something of a national pastime. Everyone knows that you can get patchy service at times, some people have good experiences, some not so good. The comments on this forum will pass unnoticed, and if they are not it would be water off a duck's back to the companies concerned as anything said on here would have no measurable effect on their business.

In your case you were making a specific complaint against a particular supplier of modelling goods which is of course related to the main subject matter of this forum. If they were to see your post and ask for a right of reply disputing your account then I would be placed in the position of hosting a public argument about a dispute to which MyHobbyStore (who are also suppliers of modelling goods!) is not a party. It would be impossible to take sides and no useful purpose would be served by it.

The privately owned Model Boat Mayhem Forum sakes an identical view. Disputes can only be settled by the parties involved off forum. Forum publishers must take a degree of responsibility for the comments hosted on their Forums and any potential legal aspects relating thereto.

An exception would be made if there is clear evidence of criminal practice or fraud but most complaints tend to revolve around 'poor service' which may be reprehensible but is not criminal.

Hope this explains things a bit. I do understand your frustration.

Colin

[Dodgy Geezer 1Participant @dodgygeezer1]

…Paul T: "There is only one rule then?"

Colin Bishop: "Yup! It's called common sense.…"

 

How very British! A gentleman does not need to tell another gentleman how to behave. And so unlike some other sites infected by Americanisms where there is a rather pointless list of naughty things you must not do…

Edited By Dodgy Geezer on 22/07/2015 21:11:54

[David Marks 2Participant @davidmarks2]

Colin – Still do not agree with you. All I can confirm is that Suffolk Trading Standards are pursuing Micro Miniatures of Lowestoft on my behalf. I will let you know the outcome.

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

David, you don't have to agree with me, just understand that I have a different perspective. Yes, do let me know the outcome.

You are involved in a specific instance here and I have no reason to doubt what you have said but the position is not always so clear cut and it is difficult, if not impossible as a third party to make a judgement as to where to draw the line. As our regular contributor Dave Milbourn will confirm, there are difficult customers as well as awkward traders. He commonly received speed controllers back for repair where the customer insisted that no, they hadn't connected it up the wrong way round from what was specified in the instructions when it was obvious to him that they had.

To take another example, people sometimes complain about kits they have bought, that the instructions are poor, the plans inaccurate and that parts don't fit together as they should. There is indeed some truth in this in some cases but manufacturers may then contend that the customer hasn't read the instructions, doesn't have the basic skills needed or expects the model to clip together like an Airfix kit without the need for some degree of modelmaking skills and there is some truth in that as well. There is a mismatch of expectations leading to a dispute and sensible Forum managers are best advised to have nothing to do with any of it.

Colin

[Dave MilbournParticipant @davemilbourn48782]

As our regular contributor Dave Milbourn will confirm, there are difficult customers as well as awkward traders.

Oh yes – and one or two are downright impossible. I can think of examples of both, but I'm all too aware that they might have the same low opinion of me!

Only David Marks and the supplier will know the absolute truth of this particular affair – and both would probably have different versions of it. David has correctly referred the matter to the right agency for dealing with it. I agree with Colin that no matter how altruistic the motives are for making it known on MB Forum (and I suspect there may be a tiny element of revenge in there?) this is no place for airing or resolving a matter for which the processes of the law have already been invoked.

Dave M

[Paul TParticipant @pault84577]

Oh yes – and one or two are downright impossible. I can think of examples of both, but I'm all too aware that they might have the same low opinion of me

I don't think that you are awkward in fact I consider you to be an all round good guy and I must be the most awkward person ever.

Paul

[Kev.WParticipant @kev-w]

I agree with Colins stance, to print (type on a website) one side of a complaint, without the 'right to reply' of the other party, is not correct, a dispute between 2 party's should remain between 2 party's.

For this forum to get involved, could involve the forum host in legal procedings, something that would cost more money than the host can afford, even if the case was proven.

Libel or even 'Bringing a persons name into disrepute', is a very serious problem in todays 'Sue anyone for anything' culture.

Edited By Kip Woods on 23/07/2015 22:53:42

Edited By Kip Woods on 23/07/2015 22:54:12

[David Marks 2Participant @davidmarks2]

Kip

As you are aware from my previous posts I have agreed to inform Colin of the outcome now that I have raised the matter with the supplier's local Trading Standards office.

Although I am not into Facebook and the like, one benefit of the internet is the ability to "tell the world" of suppliers that have given you poor service and on the flip side of the coin those that have given you good service. For example if I visit a pub/restaurant with family or friends (as I did yesterday) I place a comment on a website called Trip Adviser, and the vast majority of my feedbacks are good ones i.e like yesterday 5 out of 5.

I am also pursuing a supplier that I have used in support of my model boat hobby where I have had items on "back order" for almost two years……YES, TWO YEARS. Fortunately it was an internet transaction and payment was made by credit card, so the credit card company have taken it on. All I get from the supplier is "give me your telephone number again and I will get back to you, probably tomorrow" sadly tomorrow never comes.

[Dave MilbournParticipant @davemilbourn48782]

All I get from the supplier is "give me your telephone number again and I will get back to you, probably tomorrow" sadly tomorrow never comes.

I wouldn't need many attempts at guessing which supplier this is. Rest assured that bad news gets round this hobby a lot faster than good news, and that a supplier who regularly does dodgy things like taking payment for goods he doesn't have will eventually finish up with no business. Good riddance to them.

Dave M

[David Marks 2Participant @davidmarks2]

Regarding Dave Milbourn's comment about difficult customers. A friend of mine that I met during a walking holiday is ex RAF and very much into model aircraft. As a part time job during retirement he worked in a model shop, which apparently do a lot of trade via the internet including a lot of `exports'. They had a call (possibly by email) from a customer in (I think, Australia). "where is my model" said the customer etc etc. It turned out the model had been ordered and despatched almost 12 months earlier but the customer was claiming that it had not been received !!!! A check was made with the courier company used by the supplier but they only kept records for 4 weeks before they were destroyed, which is understandable. It is understood that the supplier refused to budge and within a short time correspondence from the customer stopped. The conclusion was that the customer was "trying it on".

[Colin BishopModerator @colinbishop34627]

Yes, there are unpleasant people on both sides of the divide but, as Dave says, the model boating community is quite small and word soon gets around about any bad apples on the trading side.

There is no reason at all not to share good experiences though and posts of this nature are always welcomed. There is the risk that if you start a 'Good Service' topic somebody will frequently jump in with a complaint of poor service but that doesn't mean that we shouldn't persevere!

Trip Advisor is a bit different in that it focuses directly on service standards. It offers a right of reply with minimal moderation and the reader is left to draw their own conclusions. I use it a lot when looking for places to stay and it is usually pretty obvious when reviews are either over positive or unfairly negative as they stand out from the other reports. Bad customers often damn themselves by what they write. Sometimes this can be inadvertent as with US tourists complaining about the small rooms and inadequate showers sometimes featured in hotels in European medieval town centres, they fail to appreciate that you can't provide Las Vegas standards in a building put up in the 1500s! Other people are more sinister in asking for an extra discount 'otherwise I will give you a bad review on Tripadvisor'.

I occasionally post reviews but on the rare occasion I have a negative comment I do try to make the criticism realistic and constructive. After all, you are having a go a people's livelihoods so you do need to be responsible in what you say.

Colin

[Dave MilbournParticipant @davemilbourn48782]

If we're gong to get a bit anecdotal, here's a few favourites for you:

Customer returned a speed controller which he'd "bought at a show very recently" – although he couldn't recall which one – and insisted that it didn't work and hadn't done from new. He demanded that it be replaced under warranty (12 months). The relay fitted to it was of a type which we hadn't used for nearly three years……..

Similar tale where the sound unit (which had also allegedly been bought at a show recently) had a type of pot fitted which hadn't been used since Craig Talbot ran ACTion (he died in 2007!). When told this the customer said "Well you must have had some old stock".

Customer rang up, demanding to know why he'd sent three E-mails over the previous two days and not had a reply to any of them. The first one was sent at 10.00pm on a Friday night and the others on Saturday and Sunday. I wonder what his working week looks like?

Customer sent back a 4-cell AA receiver pack which he had completely dismantled (heat-shrink wrapping, hot glue between cells, card insulating caps, solder tags and cable) but still couldn't get the cells into his charger – and what were we going to do about it?

Finally, how about this for E-Bay feedback – "I neither ordered, received nor paid for this item". What??

Laugh? I nearly did……………………..

Dave M

[Kimosubby ShipyardsParticipant @kimosubbyshipyards]

Ah, I've had that last one Dave, I think it's a phish? I was sent a 'give us your feedback' etc on an item I'd never even considered buying, indeed it took a while to convince my wife that I wasn't into muscle building equipment!

Kim

[The Long BuildParticipant @thelongbuild]

Customer sent back a 4-cell AA receiver pack which he had completely dismantled (heat-shrink wrapping, hot glue between cells, card insulating caps, solder tags and cable) but still couldn't get the cells into his charger – and what were we going to do about it?

i Do like the one above lol

What you should have done was sold him the suitable charger and said " when you have re-assembled it, use this !!

[ashley needhamParticipant @ashleyneedham69188]

Trip advisor. i think it is probably the case that more people post for a BAD EXPERIENCE than post for a good or adequate one. This is human nature.

I have been to the IOW for a number of years and the hotel we always use is nice and the owner friendly, but if I was to look at trip advisor you would think it is the hotel from hell.

Some customers/guests are naturally abrasive and this is what happens.

We do not want to get into the slanging match that is recrimination.

Ashley ps. the only Phish I have is with chips

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