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  • This topic has 5,251 replies, 84 voices, and was last updated 1 week, 4 days ago by Colin Bishop.
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  • #56390
    ashley needham
    Participant
      @ashleyneedham69188

      Bob, the thing performs like a good `un despite the small size.

      A paddler is on my list of things to do (not this year as I have three projects line up already)… talking of which, I was wondering when it would be that I ran out of interesting things to make, something with a twist..and it seems that I may never run out!! After proj No1, I have something very exciting to make, featuring brass gears and lots of well laquered Mahogany veneered finish, something on the face of it very conventional, but appearing completely out of the blue. Following this, possibly not this year will be something quite outrageous, featuring a bit of camper van and heaven knows what else, using techniques pioneered in the curent project No1. And it will be FAST. The source of these wonders knows no bounds, and is ripe for plundering big time.

      Now, back to the paddlers. I have been perusing the GE vids and also looking up other builds and have been a bit disappointed by the paddles. Not specifically anyones individual efforts (which are all fantastic) but by the way the paddles zoom round at a decidily un-scale speed. It doesnt look right and I have never before thought about this. I realise that this is what has to happen, the water is not scale and the paddles have to rotate much quicker than the real thing, or the boats will not move. What to do????

      I am going to give this some thought on and off before commiting to a build (likely a paddle-warship, paddles of which are mostly hidden).

      I dont want anyone to take offence at this, it is a discussion point nothing more ### usual disclaimer applies ####, if that.

      It occurs to me that in the GE case, seeing there is a prop to use, that the prop could do all the work, and the paddles could do NO work, but be driven at a more aesthetic speed. This doesn`t help paddlers with NO props (unless you stuck a sneaky prop on) .

      Over to you chaps, all 10 of you who read my ramblings. Would this make a discussion thred????

      Ashley

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      #56391
      Colin Bishop
      Moderator
        @colinbishop34627

        Sneaky prop Ashley? Shame on you! What next – bow thrusters? I think people have built effective paddle steamer models but they probably need to be of a decent size to give scale effect.

        Colin

        #56394
        ashley needham
        Participant
          @ashleyneedham69188

          Colin. I am quite shameless.

          Just a discussion point.

          Each to their own and so on.

          I am not berating anyone or anything, just thinking out loud.

          But now you mention it bow thrusters would be very handy. It must be very interesting docking a paddler with no prop wash and without using independent paddle control.

          Ashley

          #56395
          Colin Bishop
          Moderator
            @colinbishop34627

            Ashley, you are quite right. Docking a paddler is not easy! I remember many moons ago on the Isle of Wight route coming alongside Ryde pier the chap on the bridge appeared to forget there were paddles sticking out of the side of the ship. The bow came in beautifuly but the paddle box caught the edge of the pier. The ship stopped rather suddenly but the waiting passengers carried on and were skittled. No serious injuries as I remember though.

            It is interesting to watch the technique used by PS Waverley. The ship has restricted steering control when approaching the berth but lots of fore and aft control so she comes in at a respectable distance off then throws lines ashore to pull her in with the paddles used to position her alongside.

            On Lake Lucerne the crews have it down to a fine art. The ship comes alongside with a foot or so clearance and then uses just a stroke or two from the paddles to line up with the gangway. it is really impressive. But they do have lots of practice,

            Colin

            #56401
            ChrisB
            Participant
              @chrisb29081

              Hi Ashley, one of my club members has a stern wheel Mississippi paddler which is driven by a sneaky prop, with the paddle allowed to turn freely with the drag of the water, looks very good and gives a lovely 'slap' sound with each paddle.

              Chris

              #56404
              ashley needham
              Participant
                @ashleyneedham69188

                Chris B. Thanks for that.

                Colin…whatever next indeed!!

                Some thing work well as models, some dont.

                Ashley

                #56428
                ashley needham
                Participant
                  @ashleyneedham69188

                  No boating tomorrow as have another stinky cold.

                  Have not felt like fiddling with any projects today either. I need to sort out some 1/4" steel bar and the welder for proj No2, in preperation to make something and test it out before doing too much building.

                  Ashley

                  #56541
                  ashley needham
                  Participant
                    @ashleyneedham69188

                    I happened to see "the other" marine modelling type magazine in Smiths today and they too ran an article of the Sandown MEX show. They thought the stand downstairs with artfully displayed unusual models upon its tastefully clad shiny blue surface merited a special non-mention…perhaps it was all the MB posters at the back? I would say their reporting was a bit biased, not that I am biased in any way.

                    Another year passes and I will be 45 tomorrow. Where will it end eh ??? 50??? 57 ?? Once upon a time I was only one. It seems so long ago.

                    card mockup of proj no2 showing promise, needs a bit of alteration now I can see it in the flesh, and also a very unexpected source of information has surfaced.

                    A lot of brushless action on the forum at the moment, some motors of insane power are being toted as being worthy of fitment. I will be going brushless in proj No2 and so saying. Trevor is brushlessing up a couple of his older boats.

                    By way of example, his PT boat has a 540 of a standard sort in it, and it goes very nicely and on a prop Trevor admits to fitting "because he had it"…. and why not…been there, done that. Possibly a bit more go could have been had by fitting something else but I have a feeling that it would be marginal. He was looking at what to fit to pep up things a bit and my thoughts were…a few more revs would be good (on his standard 7.2V stick) and obviously a bit more power. So how much is "a bit"???? well, a STANDARD 540, if there is such a thing, is probably about 40watts, perhaps 50 at a push, probably a lot less even. He has found a (cant remember the kv now) nice little outrunner, giving a few thousand more revs theoretically and approx 80W. This should move his PT boat along very nicely indeed without being silly, and I believe he has even splashed out a fiver on a bunch of plastic props to try!!

                    You cant beat having a good handful of plastic three blade and two blade S and X pitch props to try out, loafing in your tool box. They are so cheap, and for most things not requiring a nice shiny brass one, more than adequate.

                    Ashley (usual disclaimer regarding brushless issues)

                    #56545
                    Mark Jarvis 2
                    Participant
                      @markjarvis2

                      HI Ashley

                      Sorry to tell you this!!!! but when you were one was a very long time ago………

                      Mark

                      #56546
                      Trevor Holloway
                      Participant
                        @trevorholloway99134

                        The MTB is from one of Glynn Guests free plans – prop selection was what was to hand.

                        The Speed 500E is coming out and being replaced with a 22×25 brushless 2000 kV rated at 120w max. (two delivered for £20 from a UK supplier).

                        As an added bonus the weight of the 500 is 158g and the new one is 32g the speed controller will also get lighter as an aircraft one will be used. No doubt the functional ballast (7.2v stick) will need to be moved for balance.

                        I'm sure a full report will be forthcoming once it gets back on the water.

                        #56553
                        ashley needham
                        Participant
                          @ashleyneedham69188

                          I sit corrected, I could not remember the fine details. 120W….cor, 3 times the oomph, and I had forgot about the considerable weight saving….thats a whole bag of lemon sherbets lighter!

                          Mark, You may be right…

                          I have spent some time with the welder and hacksaw/drill/file/grinder and have a fully functioning xxxxx now, or at least hopefully. I am having difficulty working out the motor access and fixture arrangements on proj no2, I have to suss this out before starting the hull, or it may be too late to alter things about. The reprofild card mockup now looks about right if I take 2 inches off the rear end. The slimmimg and raising of the xxxx on the sides looks good. I can forsee an issue at sped though, and I know what will happen but I wish to build a reasonably faithful replica of the original, so will go with it and hope the designer knew what eh was doing. The `other information source` I found is a schematic and not the boat as built and the xxxx on the side look to be more how I expected them to be. Time will tell.

                          Ashley (off for afternoon nap now I am OLD)

                          Ashley

                          #56555
                          Paul T
                          Participant
                            @pault84577

                            Sherbet lemons having 120w oomph…. I presume this is due to adding copious amounts of xxxx.

                            I don't know about needing a nap but I do think the medication needs looking at. crook

                            #56556
                            ashley needham
                            Participant
                              @ashleyneedham69188

                              I am not going to rise to this sort of bait.

                              I have been medicised lunch time and will be further medicised tonight. That should put me straight.

                              Berengar has spent a lot of his pocket money and bought me a 1/35 plastic Tortiose tank kit. a real beast. Fantastic. Not looking forward to building all the bogies though.

                              Ashley

                              #56558
                              Paul T
                              Participant
                                @pault84577

                                imagesto1apv9n.jpg

                                #56567
                                ashley needham
                                Participant
                                  @ashleyneedham69188

                                  No.

                                  #56582
                                  ashley needham
                                  Participant
                                    @ashleyneedham69188

                                    Not very nice out. Tomorrow, if on, will be the Jersey again and poss the herald with the usual lc(f) or ferry in reserve. If nice I may take Proj No1 down so the chaps can see the progress. Should see a huge difference since last time.

                                    Started cutting ply and frames for proj No2, as I have sorted out the bit that needed sorting out before I could start on the actual boat.

                                    Below, Tortiose..

                                    #56598
                                    ashley needham
                                    Participant
                                      @ashleyneedham69188

                                      Lovbely morning. Alvis, Midge and ferry will be in the boot, along with proj No1 and the card mockup for proj No2 for any observations. I have a horrible feeling that I cannot put the battery in the right place on No2, due to various circumstances and a few thoughts from the pond may be useful.

                                      Ashley

                                      #56599
                                      Bob Abell 2
                                      Participant
                                        @bobabell2

                                        Hello Ashley

                                        What's the story with the tank?

                                        What country etc and year etc

                                        Hope it's one of ours?

                                        Bob

                                        #56613
                                        ashley needham
                                        Participant
                                          @ashleyneedham69188

                                          Bob. The Tortoise was one of several "super heavy" tanks developed by the various warring parties in ww2. This is one of ours, and narrowly missed action. The invasion and subsequent speed of advance rather negated the need for such monsters. It had a converted 3.7 inch AA gunn and weighed 80 tons, speed about 8mph.It trailed in germany in 1948 and was apparently very reliable, perhaps the only super heavy tank to be so. Berengar likes his tanks and we have a big bunch of 1/32 and 1/35 kits and die cast/whatever, and although I made a Tog2 tank (which took part in our D-Day landings) , the Torty is an odd shape, hence the kit for my birthday.

                                          Todays boating ….sunny and bright but jolly cold. Quick outing for HAsty and the ferry but the rest stayed on shore. We beat a hasty retreat a bit earlier than usual as our little handies were getting frostbite.

                                          Picture, Tog2 just visible in LCT at the front….approx the right scale, it was a whopper.

                                          dscf6719.jpg

                                          Ashley

                                          #56833
                                          ashley needham
                                          Participant
                                            @ashleyneedham69188

                                            Fellow boaters. Weather not looking great today, so will just bumg the Hasty and an LCM in the car. have exciting progress to display on proj no2.

                                            Trevor may be bringing his proj down having permanently modded his bottom for added performance. Unfortunately whereas I will see if the jolly old new optical tacho works as sugested on u/j`s, this will not work on Trevors for reasoms which you will see later.

                                            I also need a bit of 4mm diameter nylon flexidrive liner for current project, just a couple of inches is all thats needed. Cant find the bits I had.

                                            Ashley

                                            #56835
                                            ashley needham
                                            Participant
                                              @ashleyneedham69188

                                              Sigh, it is raining so that scuppers that, I will be in the shed beavering away with bits of 1.5, 0.8mm ply balsa abd blue foam.

                                              I am (not unusually) having to do a lot of guess work concerning P No2, specifically around the stern and tryig to imagine how it will act when power is applied. The drive is not in the usual place and rhe body shape is not like anything I have built before and the only info i have is a 3/4 front view picture, and some fanciful drawings showing the cdraft in its imagined high speed mode (there, I have given something away..its going to be quick and covered in nice mahogany veneer)

                                              Ashley

                                              #56872
                                              Trevor Holloway
                                              Participant
                                                @trevorholloway99134

                                                Yup, raining and blowing at the pond so just tried the MTB out for a few quick laps – seems to be a bit quicker, will have to try out a couple of different props and the 8.4v stick.

                                                Puffins bottom as additional secret modifications – slight performance increase but more radical surgery required (possibility forseen and potential built in).

                                                Will try to get down again on Friday.

                                                #56999
                                                ashley needham
                                                Participant
                                                  @ashleyneedham69188

                                                  Hopefully rain permitting Trevor is going to venture to the pond tomorrow morning and we will see if my new toys work out in the measuring department, and how the new secret mods have worked out on his new secret project.

                                                  Will be interesting to see if the tacho will pick up on the u/j, as in theory , at the pond side with the boat held still, revs and current draw can be analysed and the best prop found….and we will see if this is borne out by the boat on the water.

                                                  The Proj no2 is just falling into place now…the bits just line themselves up for fitting and glueing. Motor has arrived and so work on the mount can begin, an important part of any build. Vibration in my case will be disastrous especially for a certain home made item. Off to London saturday to the 4d model shop to stock up on carbon fibre rod, ally rod, ply, styrofoam and so on.

                                                  Ashley

                                                  #57041
                                                  ashley needham
                                                  Participant
                                                    @ashleyneedham69188

                                                    Unfortunately the tacho either does not pick up properly on the u/j or we didnt get the right settings. I will try some white lines on me motor when I try next time. Will also see if it works ok on a proper air prop, as a control.

                                                    Spent a while at the pond with Trevor on friday fiddling about with his poject and useful work done (reminder….put sticky tape back in tool box). Speed much improved and secret mods working to a degree but I think the way forward has been demonstrated.

                                                    However, the PT boat is fairly zoomimg along now with the most ridiculously small brushless motor. The old Graupner speed 500E which was fitted was about 50 times heavier and 1000 times more crude (or thereabouts). The motor I have to fit in my proj No2 may be possibly a bit overkill, however this gives my a good margin of power to play with and this may mean a larger prop can be fitted. The larger 35mm diameter will of course give me much more torque to turn this larger prop. The mechanical staying power of certain home made items remains a worry, but we can only see.

                                                    Proj no 2 now looking good..Motor to be fitted and then after that several servos, control lines, rudder arrangement space to fit Rx and ESc and batter…well, its almost there!! I am not quite happy with the tail end, but I have made alterations to cater for the likely performance and , er, floatational..qualities of the rear end..or not, …it is very thin at the back and I am worring about the back being too low. Just in case, I bought some 4mm styrofoam to plate the underneath with if it is that more bouyancy is required.

                                                    Have been to the 4d model shop and come away with all the goodies….the place is a treasure trove. The carbon fibre rod is just spectacular for its strength, thinness of wall and stiffness. Amazing stuff. Dissapointingly they did not have sufficiently large bits of veneer, to finish no2 with but I may have to go to a specialist sort of supplier for this.. suggestions plse (Mahogany veneer reqd, and suggestions of a good glue..not contact..not a fan of that)

                                                    Ashley

                                                    #57065
                                                    Paul T
                                                    Participant
                                                      @pault84577

                                                      Ashley

                                                      I use waterproof PVA for sticking veneer down, very good adhesion and plenty of 'play time' to get everything lined up correctly.

                                                      Use an even coat of PVA over the base board and apply firm even pressure to the veneer whilst the glue cures to prevent air pockets forming.

                                                      I'm experimenting with Gorilla Glue whilst building Charlie and so far its quite impressive.

                                                      I really want to play some more with carbon fibre and might do a vac formed hull out of it this summer.

                                                      Paul

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